going down.. going down.. going down

Originally Posted by Charlestown Rouge

No need to - they are going to be dealt with by their own party.

He's not a scapegoat - that would indicate that he's taking all the blame when a good number of MPs are going to be declared culpable and forced to stand down.

are they? how do you know?

scapegoat, witch hunt, call it what you like.

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

are they? how do you know?

scapegoat, witch hunt, call it what you like.

Brown said he'll deselect anyone found guilty.

Maybe he's spoofing.

Scapegoat is different from witch hunt. Scapegoat is singular.

Going Down by Springsteen, great song

Originally Posted by Charlestown Rouge

Nonsense.

Brown indicated that guilty MPs would not be selected for the next election before Martin resigned.

They've announced changes to MP's expenses tonight and the Kelly Committee will report back after the Summer.

Fact is the liberal use of the word "scapegoat" is the sort of simplifying and factually incorrect analysis of the situation, that a tabloid could have used it.

'Guilty MPs' meaning those who are found guilty. Which is my point, there's an awful lot of guilt and wrongdoing by an awful lot of MPs, but they won't all get punished. Some will, and they will be scapegoats because it won't be the powerful ones. They'll just pay back the money & keep their positions.

As for announcing changes to the expenses system, well, yes, that pretty much backs up what I said. They're capping the amount of money they can claim for mortgages! Whoopee! Maybe they can also explain why they actually get to claim anything anyway, and why they can't pay it out of their wages, like taxpayers do?

It's the system that's rotten and needs massively changing, not finetuning.

Originally Posted by Charlestown Rouge

Brown said he'll deselect anyone found guilty.

Maybe he's spoofing.

Scapegoat is different from witch hunt. Scapegoat is singular.

scapegoat, witch hunt, call it what you like.

Originally Posted by MrBishi

'Guilty MPs' meaning those who are found guilty. Which is my point, there's an awful lot of guilt and wrongdoing by an awful lot of MPs, but they won't all get punished. Some will, and they will be scapegoats because it won't be the powerful ones. They'll just pay back the money & keep their positions.

As for announcing changes to the expenses system, well, yes, that pretty much backs up what I said. They're capping the amount of money they can claim for mortgages! Whoopee! Maybe they can also explain why they actually get to claim anything anyway, and why they can't pay it out of their wages, like taxpayers do?

It's the system that's rotten and needs massively changing, not finetuning.

Which powerful MPs are you talking about - specifically?

The moves announced today are interim, the Kelly Committee will recommend the overhaul on expenses.

Originally Posted by Charlestown Rouge

Which powerful MPs are you talking about - specifically?

The moves announced today are interim, the Kelly Committee will recommend the overhaul on expenses.

will it recommend that expenses are means tested?

will it recommend that 2nd homes are fit for purpose and nothing more, in particular insofar as expenses are claimed ie one human needs only one bedroom etc - all additional bedrooms are paid from your own pocket?

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

will it recommend that expenses are means tested?

will it recommend that 2nd homes are fit for purpose and nothing more, in particular insofar as expenses are claimed ie one human needs only one bedroom etc - all additional bedrooms are paid from your own pocket?

Funny enough - no idea.

Didn't get a second interview.

Don't be cross with me.

Originally Posted by Charlestown Rouge

Funny enough - no idea.

Didn't get a second interview.

Don't be cross with me.

not cross with you love

it's just that on the one hand you're saying you know what's going to happen, while on the other hand you're saying that you don't know what's going to happen

Originally Posted by MrBishi

Oh, and there'll be token rule changes to crack down on abuse expenses, but the system will still be there for MPs to claim allowances on all their living expenses, despite them also having a wage.

A little more than token changes.

Originally Posted by Charlestown Rouge

Nonsense.

Brown indicated that guilty MPs would not be selected for the next election before Martin resigned.

They've announced changes to MP's expenses tonight and the Kelly Committee will report back after the Summer.

Fact is the liberal use of the word "scapegoat" is the sort of simplifying and factually incorrect analysis of the situation, that a tabloid could have used it.

Depends on your definition of "guilty" though doesn't it.

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

not cross with you love

it's just that on the one hand you're saying you know what's going to happen, while on the other hand you're saying that you don't know what's going to happen

On one hand, I'm quoting Gordon Brown and the now-ex Speaker and on the other I'm anticipating a full committee report that no-one knows about.

Stop being silly Throbster.

I'm still confused i see "going down, going down" and a thread started by lawless I expect to see Geordies crying or massive amounts of beaver ..

what gives???

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

scapegoat, witch hunt, call it what you like.

i call it long overdue justice

Originally Posted by bcred

I'm still confused i see "going down, going down" and a thread started by lawless I expect to see Geordies crying or massive amounts of beaver ..

what gives???

sundee night bcred.....sundee night

Originally Posted by Charlestown Rouge

On one hand, I'm quoting Gordon Brown and the now-ex Speaker and on the other I'm anticipating a full committee report that no-one knows about.

Stop being silly Throbster.

for a start off, Brown can't deselect anybody from any other parties other than his own

basically we have absolutely no idea as to exactly what will be deemed a sackable/deselectable offence or exactly who will get turfed out

what we do know is that certain individuals are trying to make political capital out of the whole situation

Originally Posted by denis lawless

i call it long overdue justice

in a month's time the MPs who fiddled their expenses will vote for a new speaker

hope this helps

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

in a month's time the MPs who fiddled their expenses will vote for a new speaker

hope this helps

just proves my point that they are all a bunch of @#%&!, basically taking the piss on a grand scale

still...any high profile politician getting a good shoeing is welcome.....many more to come, fingers crossed :banana:

(from all parties Throbs !!!!)

Originally Posted by denis lawless

still...any high profile politician getting a good shoeing is welcome.....many more to come, fingers crossed

they will be replaced by others, the speaker will be replaced by others, the expenses rules will be replaced by others...

the public are ill-informed, misinformed, misled and dripfed by a media desperate to sell itself

the whole thing is a £#%&!ing joke

the Telegraph should've produced a special edition, charged a tenner for it or whatever, and printed everything they know

then this debate might have had some proper structure to it instead of the fortnighht long moral panic that we've seen