The Rawk Nuggets Thread: 2023-24

Is he even in the top 5 Premier League managers? Certainly behind Fergie, Wenger and Mourinho. You'd have to put Guardiola above him even if he's got an asterisk next to his achievements. Ranieri arguably accomplished more at Leicester pound for pound.

Originally Posted by Dr Stranger

Lovely stuff

Liverpool fans love to talk about points accumulated, the finals they’ve made - they seem to equate nearly doing something with actually doing something.

They've always been like that. Remember how they would go all misty-eyed about their famous 2009 team, which won absolutely £#%&! all?

Originally Posted by Kent Brockman

Is he even in the top 5 Premier League managers? Certainly behind Fergie, Wenger and Mourinho. You'd have to put Guardiola above him even if he's got an asterisk next to his achievements. Ranieri arguably accomplished more at Leicester pound for pound.

Fergie is clear no 1 and Pep clear No 2 IMO. Wenger and Jose interchangeable. Then Klopp.

Originally Posted by Hyman_Roth

So does everyone think Pep is a far superior manager to Klopp? That having unlimited resources isn’t a slight advantage?

Not sure I’d put them too far apart and in many ways, I’d say Klopp manages to get more out of bang average players than Pep could ever do. Pep has had Silva and De Bruyne at their peaks - players that every other uk club would have lost if it wasn’t for the 2nd salaries.

I’d prefer to give more credit to Klopp than I ever would do those cheating @#%&!s.

pep for me is in any list of top 10 managers of all time. he has had a profound impact on how the game is played.

klopp probably would be in the top 50.

Originally Posted by Zorg

They've always been like that. Remember how they would go all misty-eyed about their famous 2009 team, which won absolutely £#%&! all?

Saw some montage on Twitter of their 2018/19 season, asking “is this the best side the league ever saw” - they didn’t even win the league that season 😂

Originally Posted by Dr Stranger

Fergie is clear no 1 and Pep clear No 2 IMO. Wenger and Jose interchangeable. Then Klopp.

I’d have Wenger above Guardiola. No doubting that he turns teams into utter machines, but he’s basically been allowed to buy literally any and every player he desires, no matter the cost.

Jose was similar at Chelsea, but he still operated in a more competitive league (imo) and at least he won the CL with Porto, which is an astonishing achievement no matter which way you look at it. Guardiola only managed to win the CL prior to last year with a Barcelona team that had Messi, Puyol, Busquets, Xavi, Iniesta, among others.

PL era top managers -
1) Sir Alex
2) Wenger
3) Big Sam
4) Jose
5) Guardiola

I guess. Thinking about it, lance armstrong was still an excellent cyclist at the end of the day. People should be able to see past all the cheating when assessing Pep’s managerial achievements.

Originally Posted by Hyman_Roth

I guess. Thinking about it, lance armstrong was an excellent cyclist at the end of the day. People should be able to see past all the cheating when assessing Pep’s managerial achievements.

wenger inherited graham's defence and wasn't even responsible for buying bergkamp. var would have taken their titles and the invincible tag.

mourinho can £#%&! off. even with two first teams, the cheating, shit football and histionics rule him out. he's just a toxic version of pep with no football philosophy.

fergie, van gaal, pep.... in that order.

Originally Posted by Dr Stranger

Fergie is clear no 1 and Pep clear No 2 IMO. Wenger and Jose interchangeable. Then Klopp.

Tbf Mourinho won 2 champions leagues, Wenger won nowt in Europe.
Also Wenger inherited the best back four in the country at the time and probably one of the best ever in England. Struggled once they'd all retired.

Originally Posted by NedKelly

I’d have Wenger above Guardiola. No doubting that he turns teams into utter machines, but he’s basically been allowed to buy literally any and every player he desires, no matter the cost.

Jose was similar at Chelsea, but he still operated in a more competitive league (imo) and at least he won the CL with Porto, which is an astonishing achievement no matter which way you look at it. Guardiola only managed to win the CL prior to last year with a Barcelona team that had Messi, Puyol, Busquets, Xavi, Iniesta, among others.

PL era top managers -
1) Sir Alex
2) Wenger
3) Big Sam
4) Jose
5) Guardiola

Wenger’s numbers are similar to Klopp in that he didn’t clean up in the way that Fergie did and that Pep is doing (*) and he had a better team ahead of him most of the time. Contrary to most, I actually really like Wenger. He was ahead of his time, but 3 titles in, what, nearly 20 years? No champions league.

City only other team apart from us to dominate an era in the last 30 years (*)

People are just being a bit daft now.

Wenger won 7 FA Cups :Bellers:
20 consecutive top four finishes
3 league titles, and would have been more if he didn’t come up against the best football manager of all time in his prime.

Originally Posted by Ethers

People are just being a bit daft now.

Wenger won 7 FA Cups :Bellers:
20 consecutive top four finishes
3 league titles, and would have been more if he didn’t come up against the best football manager of all time in his prime.

Wenger was a brilliant manager. Created a couple of brilliant teams, and at a time when the club was rebuilding their stadium, so didn’t have as much money to spend as he might. In terms of dynasty and club building too, he’s only second to fergie.

Mourinho won trophies at numerous clubs, fergie, Klopp and pep too. That’s maybe the only box Wenger doesn’t tick, but it’s a harsh mark against him for his loyalty.

Originally Posted by NedKelly

he won the CL with Porto, which is an astonishing achievement no matter which way you look at it.

scholes was being played on by the entire porto team, ever looked at it that way?
also this
https://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...on-803451.html
but that's just a coincidence

Originally Posted by Ethers

People are just being a bit daft now.

Wenger won 7 FA Cups :Bellers:
20 consecutive top four finishes
3 league titles, and would have been more if he didn’t come up against the best football manager of all time in his prime.

That’s why I said he’s similar to Klopp in the sense that he’s always mostly been behind a better team and manager and his numbers reflect that.

If City win four leagues on the bounce and their 6th (is it?) under Pep, it’s hard to make a case for anyone else being 2nd IMO

I suppose it comes down to how you consider greatness. I think Wenger brought a whole new standard in terms of what he did and the level he made Fergie go to. That doesn’t really reflect in the numbers.

Edit: I didn’t realise he’d won 7 FA Cups

One thing that always winds up Arsenal fans if you say it, but I think is true, is that Wenger winning two Doubles was a greater achievement than the 'invincibles'.

Originally Posted by Zorg

One thing that always winds up Arsenal fans if you say it, but I think is true, is that Wenger winning two Doubles was a greater achievement than the 'invincibles'.

tell them we lost less games in the treble season than arsenal did in their invincible season
not necessarily to wind them up but because its true

Originally Posted by larry

tell them we lost less games in the treble season than arsenal did in their invincible season
not necessarily to wind them up but because its true

can we say “fewer” please? stops them responding with an obvious one.

Originally Posted by avocado

can we say “fewer” please? stops them responding with an obvious one.

can we not be a grammar nob head

Originally Posted by larry

can we not be a grammar nob head

It’s #@&%!