Team v Chelsea - The Official Thread

Originally Posted by dunk

O'Shea is looking a lot leaner this season and very confident, looked good at RB imo.

Yea. But I loved Fabio's cameo, him & his brother are always great entertainment

Originally Posted by marlo

i think we have a big striking problem and it will be become apparent when 'touchs and moves' cant mask a our poor tally of goals.

I think we'll struggle to score the goals we've lost with Ronnie too. There's barely anyone in the side to stretch the opposing defenses, while the opposition will be able to concentrate on keeping Rooney out the game as they no longer have to worry about Ronaldo. Hopefully Berbatov can take up that mantle, but only time will tell.

Originally Posted by Rhodzy

Park annoyed the £#%&! out of me today. Still think we need a winger and an attacking midfielder tbh. Fletch was very good today.

Another winger? I like park, but as I've always thought he was little more then a squad player. He simply does not have the technical quality of those around him, especially in an attacking sense. He's got good movement, but his touch and quality of pass let him down too often.

Originally Posted by marlo

he didnt do well at all if we judge him like a winger.

moves broke down with, he didnt make anything of his chances and he didnt get any balls in the box. when he should have slid rooney in, he played the wrong ball to berbs.

You saw what you saw, I saw what I saw.

I'm not going to bother arguing. You keep harping on about him as you do many others in the squad - shit, a clown, not good enough etc. I rate him as a squad player and think he did well enough today. All about expectations IMO.

He'll probably be in the first XI more often than not this season but that's because he's third choice in the wide areas now. Should he be? I don't know. But then folk keep saying Utd should buy Villa, Silva, Ribery etc. I'm trying to be a touch more rational and not think we're going to, or can, spend 40million+ on one player.

Originally Posted by The Watcher

I think we'll struggle to score the goals we've lost with Ronnie too. There's barely anyone in the side to stretch the opposing defenses, while the opposition will be able to concentrate on keeping Rooney out the game as they no longer have to worry about Ronaldo. Hopefully Berbatov can take up that mantle, but only time will tell.

I am hoping that playing Berbs further up, and having a conventional right winger in Valencia (and maybe Nani on the left) will work well.

Like a return to the style of 1994 (wishful thinking, I know) with Berbatov in the role of a more gifted, but considerably more lightweight, Hughes.

Rooney could play the role of Eric.

Major problem with this theory is the lack of a Keane/Ince axis...

Originally Posted by The Watcher

Yea. But I loved Fabio's cameo, him & his brother are always great entertainment



I think we'll struggle to score the goals we've lost with Ronnie too. There's barely anyone in the side to stretch the opposing defenses, while the opposition will be able to concentrate on keeping Rooney out the game as they no longer have to worry about Ronaldo. Hopefully Berbatov can take up that mantle, but only time will tell.

Fabio's shift was encouraging.

I don't think we'll struggle to score tbh. I don't know if we'll completely replace Ronaldo's goals but I think there are goals in this squad so I'm not going to worry too much yet. Fergie won't buy another striker, rates Macheda and Wellbeck (too) highly IMO. Diouf arriving in January as well.

I like Park, but he was shite today.In all fairness though, Valencia has the right side of midfield nailed down as his own.

JOS really shouldn't be a starter at RB unless Fabio, Rafael and Wes are injured/banned.Heis basic defending today was dreadful.

I thought, first half anyway, that we were very good and there was lots of positives.Sounds bitter, but the referee was the deciding factor today.

Gutted for Nani but I feel positive for this coming season.

Also gutted to see the return of that dirty, cheating, snidey £#%&!er Carvalho. The absolute master of the cynical foul that @#%&!.

Originally Posted by Whalefish

Fabio's shift was encouraging.

I don't think we'll struggle to score tbh. I don't know if we'll completely replace Ronaldo's goals but I think there are goals in this squad so I'm not going to worry too much yet. Fergie won't buy another striker, rates Macheda and Wellbeck (too) highly IMO. Diouf arriving in January as well.

I did some working out the other day.

Last year Ronaldo scored 18 league goals, 4 of which were penalties. 17 at home, 1 away (West Brom).

So, we need to find a decent penalty taker first and foremost. A freekick specialist would be a bonus.

After that, there's a matter of 13 home goals and 1 away (if you forget the pens) to be divided up around Berbatov, Rooney, Macheda, Valencia, Nani, Carrick, Owen, Fletcher and the rest.

When you look at it like that - and when you think of the number of chances the likes of Owen will get at home to the shite teams - it doesn't seem quite so daunting a task.

We don't need another wide player, both Ljajic and Obertan will be competing for places soon enough. I'm still not sure about the central midfield, we've got enough to beat most teams in the league and give a good game to the rest but something does seem to be lacking there, maybe Fergie wants to keep the way clear for a couple of the young lads coming through like Petrucci and James and hopefully Hargreaves will return to add some drive.

Originally Posted by magic_cantona

I like Park, but he was shite today.In all fairness though, Valencia has the right side of midfield nailed down as his own.

If I was a knee jerk idiot, after today's cameo, I'd say that was a load of nonsense. His first touch was garbage and he looked scared to death when he had an opportunity to take the ball forwards.

Thankfully, I'm not but he's going to have to earn that nailed down spot. Nothing guaranteed atm.

Originally Posted by Terry Silver

I did some working out the other day.

Last year Ronaldo scored 18 league goals, 4 of which were penalties. 17 at home, 1 away (West Brom).

So, we need to find a decent penalty taker first and foremost. A freekick specialist would be a bonus.

After that, there's a matter of 13 home goals and 1 away (if you forget the pens) to be divided up around Berbatov, Rooney, Macheda, Valencia, Nani, Carrick, Owen, Fletcher and the rest.

When you look at it like that - and when you think of the number of chances the likes of Owen will get at home to the shite teams - it doesn't seem quite so daunting a task.

Excellent post.

Originally Posted by Whalefish

If I was a knee jerk idiot, after today's cameo, I'd say that was a load of nonsense. His first touch was garbage and he looked scared to death when he had an opportunity to take the ball forwards.

Thankfully, I'm not but he's going to have to earn that nailed down spot. Nothing guaranteed atm.

I'd go along with that. Totally in ashley cole's pocket.

Originally Posted by Terry Silver

Major problem with this theory is the lack of a Keane/Ince axis...

I think this 442 system will be used a lot in the League, especially at home. But we'll still change to a 451/433 for tough aways and in Europe. Nothing new there really and it's hard to argue against given the success it's brought.

But I agree with the point highlighted - without a tough midfield presence, we could come unstuck at times. Especially when you look at how badly we coped with sides that pressed us aggressively last season.

Originally Posted by Whalefish

I don't think we'll struggle to score tbh. I don't know if we'll completely replace Ronaldo's goals but I think there are goals in this squad so I'm not going to worry too much yet. Fergie won't buy another striker, rates Macheda and Wellbeck (too) highly IMO. Diouf arriving in January as well.

Hope you're right - but the lack of goals from midfield is a worry. In the last three years it's primary role has been to cover the defense and get the ball to Ronnie & Rooney to put away. It'll be quite a shift of emphasis for those players to now be expected to chip in with 15-20 goals between them.

Kiko and Welbeck will get us a few no doubt. Will Valencia and Nani? Who knows. As for Owen, my suspicion is that he will not be the success we're hoping for. I pray every night (no joke) that signing the @#%&! is another masterstroke from The Boss, but I think Owen's washed up and well past his best.

Originally Posted by Sandman

We don't need another wide player, both Ljajic and Obertan will be competing for places soon enough. I'm still not sure about the central midfield, we've got enough to beat most teams in the league and give a good game to the rest but something does seem to be lacking there, maybe Fergie wants to keep the way clear for a couple of the young lads coming through like Petrucci and James and hopefully Hargreaves will return to add some drive.

I cannot wait to see Ljajic in a United shirt. Long term, isn't he the closest thing we have to a young Paul Scholes?

Originally Posted by The Watcher

I think this 442 system will be used a lot in the League, especially at home. But we'll still change to a 451/433 for tough aways and in Europe. Nothing new there really and it's hard to argue against given the success it's brought.

But I agree with the point highlighted - without a tough midfield presence, we could come unstuck at times. Especially when you look at how badly we coped with sides that pressed us aggressively last season.



Hope you're right - but the lack of goals from midfield is a worry. In the last three years it's primary role has been to cover the defense and get the ball to Ronnie & Rooney to put away. It'll be quite a shift of emphasis for those players to now be expected to chip in with 15-20 goals between them.

Kiko and Welbeck will get us a few no doubt. Will Valencia and Nani? Who knows. As for Owen, my suspicion is that he will not be the success we're hoping for. I pray every night (no joke) that signing the @#%&! is another masterstroke from The Boss, but I think Owen's washed up and well past his best.

Very hard to judge owen so far tbh. Scored goals against vastly inferior opposition on tour, missed a hatful against valencia and only on the pitch for 15 mins today.

Originally Posted by Sparky***

Very hard to judge owen so far tbh. Scored goals against vastly inferior opposition on tour, missed a hatful against valencia and only on the pitch for 15 mins today.

He gives us something we don't have. He basically lives on the last shoulder of the centre backs, and waits for the through ball. We have an array of players capable of knocking that ball through. It's nice to have somebody with the greedy attitude of a centre forward.

I know it's a cliche, but to get 4 chances against Valencia in the first place is pretty encouraging.

But I reserve the right to revise my optimism if he continues to miss 4 sitters per game.

Originally Posted by The Watcher

I cannot wait to see Ljajic in a United shirt. Long term, isn't he the closest thing we have to a young Paul Scholes?

Looked class in any clips I've seen of him, and only heard good things.

Reckon we should be having a good look at this Ukrainian U-19 squad that apparently took apart a very highly rated Serbia side.

Originally Posted by Sparky***

Very hard to judge owen so far tbh.

The guy relied on his pace when he was actually any good. Now that's gone, he offers very little. As an all round footballer, he isn't great. And it usually takes him half a dozen games to get his finishing right. If Berbatov and Rooney are fit, he won't get that time.

Originally Posted by The Watcher

The guy relied on his pace when he was actually any good. Now that's gone, he offers very little. As an all round footballer, he isn't great. And it usually takes him half a dozen games to get his finishing right. If Berbatov and Rooney are fit, he won't get that time.

I disagree. He's still pretty rapid over 10 yards. Prolonged sprints over 40 yards, of course he's not going to be as quick as when he was 20 what with the injuries he's had.

Originally Posted by Sparky***

I disagree. He's still pretty rapid over 10 yards. Prolonged sprints over 40 yards, of course he's not going to be as quick as when he was 20 what with the injuries he's had.

Well, for all our sakes, let's hope you're right and @#%&! still has something to offer.

Originally Posted by The Watcher

Well, for all our sakes, let's hope you're right and @#%&! still has something to offer.

8 league goals in 25 games (20 starts) last season in a woeful Newcastle side.

Instead of having a supply line of Duff, Smith, Nolan and Viduka he now has Rooney, Carrick, Scholes and Berba...

Tevez only got 7 league goals in 26 games the year he kept West Ham up.