Ryan Giggs.

giggs played well, no coincidence that he happened to be playing out wide, is not a centre forward and looks lost when he plays there, out wide or nowhere imo.

Originally Posted by MUFC One Love

Funny how it was usually Giggs...just like it was at Pompey...etc.

that's a sad crusade you're on there young man. Giggs was part of another excellent United team performance. Luckily he gets the respect he deserves off his manager, coaches and team-mates. A respect sadly lacking from some of the more clueless cretins who won't realise what they've lost until Giggs hangs up his boots.

Yeah he is beyond criticism mate, after all he has won 9 title so he is deserving of a place for ever surely? At the end of the day a lot of people have admitted Giggs has been very poor this season. But if you question him you're a clueless cretin surely?

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

that's a sad crusade you're on there young man. Giggs was part of another excellent United team performance. Luckily he gets the respect he deserves off his manager, coaches and team-mates. A respect sadly lacking from some of the more clueless cretins who won't realise what they've lost until Giggs hangs up his boots.

I wish I had a pound for every time I've heard someone say we won't realise what we've lost until Giggs hangs up his boots.

Truly great players you know how good they are when they're still playing.

He's been a good player for us for a long time but let's not try and elevate him into some sort of Best, Law, Charlton, Robson type figure. That would be an affront to those great players.

But yeah he's got 9 league titles bla bla blazzzzzzzz

Originally Posted by poppy

I wish I had a pound for every time I've heard someone say we won't realise what we've lost until Giggs hangs up his boots.

Truly great players you know how good they are when they're still playing.

He's been a good player for us for a long time but let's not try and elevate him into some sort of Best, Law, Charlton, Robson type figure. That would be an affront to those great players.

But yeah he's got 9 league titles bla bla blazzzzzzzz

£#%&! off please.

He is a great you moron. He's been a 'good player' for the last seasons, before that he was fantastic. Some United supporters have the shortest memory span. By all means debate whether he should be in the team right at this moment, but to fog him off as just a 'good player for us' is a £#%&!ing insult mate and you need clocking. You turd.

Originally Posted by eduardo (no capital at the start)

£#%&! off please.

He is a great you moron. He's been a 'good player' for the last seasons, before that he was fantastic. Some United supporters have the shortest memory span. By all means debate whether he should be in the team right at this moment, but to fog him off as just a 'good player for us' is a £#%&!ing insult mate and you need clocking. You turd.

Paul Scholes is a great player and has been a great player.

Ryan Giggs has had more bad games for United (6 out of 10 and below) than any other player in our history. He's been a very good player. Great is a word used far too often nowadays. Like it is in Giggs' case.

If you ask 10 United fans to name Giggs' best season for us or his peak years, you're more than likely to get 10 different answers. That's because he's never had a truly great season for us. Kanchelskis had a better and more consistent season for us in his short time at United than Giggs has in all his time here. That's why his fellow professionals (the ones he plays against week in week out) have never deemed Giggs as worthy as a place in the top three players in the league. It took him until last season to win his first player of the month award!

But just because you disagree with someone there's no need to get all juvenile and offensive and throw your dummy out of your pram.

Chill.

Originally Posted by poppy

Paul Scholes is a great player and has been a great player.

Ryan Giggs has had more bad games for United (6 out of 10 and below) than any other player in our history. He's been a very good player. Great is a word used far too often nowadays. Like it is in Giggs' case.

If you ask 10 United fans to name Giggs' best season for us or his peak years, you're more than likely to get 10 different answers. That's because he's never had a truly great season for us. Kanchelskis had a better and more consistent season for us in his short time at United than Giggs has in all his time here. That's why his fellow professionals (the ones he plays against week in week out) have never deemed Giggs as worthy as a place in the top three players in the league. It took him until last season to win his first player of the month award!

But just because you disagree with someone there's no need to get all juvenile and offensive and throw your dummy out of your pram.

Chill.

sorry you're wrong. If you watch over the season reviews of every single United season since 91/92 you will see just how important he was/is. And why then did he win the PFA Young player of the year on two occasions? If everyone fails to see how good he is Not to mention his goal record is one of the best for a non-forward. Plus longevity and the fact he was a regular when we were at our most successful ever just shows how great he is. I'm not saying we'll miss him terribly when he retires, but he will retire an alltime United great and most of the supporters know this - with the odd exception such as yourself who just looooves to be controversial.

Originally Posted by poppy

Paul Scholes is a great player and has been a great player.

Ryan Giggs has had more bad games for United (6 out of 10 and below) than any other player in our history. He's been a very good player. Great is a word used far too often nowadays. Like it is in Giggs' case.

If you ask 10 United fans to name Giggs' best season for us or his peak years, you're more than likely to get 10 different answers. That's because he's never had a truly great season for us. Kanchelskis had a better and more consistent season for us in his short time at United than Giggs has in all his time here. That's why his fellow professionals (the ones he plays against week in week out) have never deemed Giggs as worthy as a place in the top three players in the league. It took him until last season to win his first player of the month award!

But just because you disagree with someone there's no need to get all juvenile and offensive and throw your dummy out of your pram.

Chill.

It took Scholes until last year to be named in the top 3 players in the league by his fellow professionals, was he not a great player before that?

I would make a bet that Giggs has been named in the PFA team of the year on more occasions than Scholes has.

But I am not going to change your mind, you have peddled this opinion of Giggs for years. He has been an inconsistent player, it is the nature of the position and style he has, but he could reach heights of sheer genius that very few players in the world could reach. In the CL, the highest standard of football in the world, he has consistently been our best player, year in year out.

As for the Scholes/Giggs debate, Giggs at his peak was a better player than Scholes, Scholes has been more consistent perhaps, but in the big games Giggs has always been the more likely player to change the game for us.

Originally Posted by eduardo (no capital at the start)

sorry you're wrong. If you watch over the season reviews of every single United season since 91/92 you will see just how important he was/is. And why then did he win the PFA Young player of the year on two occasions? If everyone fails to see how good he is Not to mention his goal record is one of the best for a non-forward. Plus longevity and the fact he was a regular when we were at our most successful ever just shows how great he is. I'm not saying we'll miss him terribly when he retires, but he will retire an alltime United great and most of the supporters know this - with the odd exception such as yourself who just looooves to be controversial.

Goal record? One in every 5.5 games. Pires got one in every 3 for Arsenal playing in exactly the same position.

I'm not saying he hasn't been a mighty fine player and for his service and longevity will rightly be regarded as a United legend.

I'm simply saying all these fans who are trying to re-write history and bracket him with the Maradonas, George Bests, Zinedine Zidanes of the game (those are what I would call greats) are living in cloud cuckoo land and clearly forgetting how piss poor he has been in an awful lot of games.

If you ask most United fans if he developed into the player you thought he would when he first arrived on the scene, I'd saymost, if they were being honest, would say no.

Originally Posted by poppy

Goal record? One in every 5.5 games. Pires got one in every 3 for Arsenal playing in exactly the same position.

I'm not saying he hasn't been a mighty fine player and for his service and longevity will rightly be regarded as a United legend.

I'm simply saying all these fans who are trying to re-write history and bracket him with the Maradonas, George Bests, Zinedine Zidanes of the game (those are what I would call greats) are living in cloud cuckoo land and clearly forgetting how piss poor he has been in an awful lot of games.

If you ask most United fans if he developed into the player you thought he would when he first arrived on the scene, I'd saymost, if they were being honest, would say no.

Who classed him the same as Zidane/Maradona You're just making stuff up now. You originally said that he shouldn't be classed with Law/Robson - well whether you like it or not, he will be. He will probably retire with the most appearances for the club - so of course he'll have had bad games. There's just no pleasing some people.

And get over Arsenal already.

Originally Posted by poppy

Goal record? One in every 5.5 games. Pires got one in every 3 for Arsenal playing in exactly the same position.

I'm not saying he hasn't been a mighty fine player and for his service and longevity will rightly be regarded as a United legend.

I'm simply saying all these fans who are trying to re-write history and bracket him with the Maradonas, George Bests, Zinedine Zidanes of the game (those are what I would call greats) are living in cloud cuckoo land and clearly forgetting how piss poor he has been in an awful lot of games.

If you ask most United fans if he developed into the player you thought he would when he first arrived on the scene, I'd saymost, if they were being honest, would say no.

Giggs has been a better player than Pires over the course of their careers. 2 different styles anyway, Pires had a strikers instincts in the box, real composure and intelligence, but Giggs was the far more explosive and dynamic player, and he has pretty much always looked to create rather than score himself.

It is a weakness in his game actually, poor finishing and an unwillingness to shoot.

Giggs goals scoring record stands up well to his peers, Figo for example is closer to 1/6 than 1/5(which is Giggs record).

Very few have put Giggs up there with Zidane and co, but he has been one of the top European players of the last generation and is certainly up there with the likes of Figo.

So you're agreeing he falls short of being a true great of the game but you'd still bracket him as a United great.

I'd say Best, Law and Charlton were not just United greats, but true greats of the game.

Anyway, I don't think this is a discussion about Giggs' ability as a footballer but more about the (mis)use of the word great.

Like I said initially, it's used far too readily nowadays.

Originally Posted by Tiberian

Giggs has been a better player than Pires over the course of their careers. 2 different styles anyway, Pires had a strikers instincts in the box, real composure and intelligence, but Giggs was the far more explosive and dynamic player, and he has pretty much always looked to create rather than score himself.

It is a weakness in his game actually, poor finishing and an unwillingness to shoot.

Giggs goals scoring record stands up well to his peers, Figo for example is closer to 1/6 than 1/5(which is Giggs record).

Very few have put Giggs up there with Zidane and co, but he has been one of the top European players of the last generation and is certainly up there with the likes of Figo.

Agreed. I'd but him around Figo's level. Very good players.

Originally Posted by poppy

Agreed. I'd but him around Figo's level. Very good players.

So you would say that Scholes has been a greater player than Figo?

Does that mean that Scholes is in the bracket of Zidane, or is there another level below that, but above the Figo/Giggs level?

Who goes in that? Bergkamp? Rivaldo? Henry?

Originally Posted by poppy

So you're agreeing he falls short of being a true great of the game but you'd still bracket him as a United great.

I'd say Best, Law and Charlton were not just United greats, but true greats of the game.

Anyway, I don't think this is a discussion about Giggs' ability as a footballer but more about the (mis)use of the word great.

Like I said initially, it's used far too readily nowadays.

so you've seen every single one of Charltons performances for United?

Originally Posted by eduardo (no capital at the start)

so you've seen every single one of Charltons performances for United?

A large amount of them.

Bergkamp, Rivaldo, Henry and Scholes are/were all superior footballers to Giggs in my opinion.

Originally Posted by poppy

Goal record? One in every 5.5 games. Pires got one in every 3 for Arsenal playing in exactly the same position.

To be fair Pires only played in England when he was at his peak Giggsy's apperances include the ascendancy of his career and what will be among his last few years as a professional.

Giggs is the most frustrating player I've ever witnessed. Why? Simply because he could have been among the best five players in the world, yet in my opinion never has been, at any time.

Still brilliant though.

wtf. talk about shying away from the debate, i thought this was how giggsy has been playing THIS season

to join the historical fun for a second, the guy's an absolute legend and will go down as one of uniteds greatest ever.


that doesn't mean he doesn't have shit patches though, it's nearly inevitable. i also think scholes and carrick have been pretty rubbish this season. so what


and for the record he doesn't exactly look the part as the kind of captain we need. give it to rooney

give it to ronnie. He will be national team captain in very near future.

Club and national team captain. ronnie.