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Unread 23-09-2019, 09:33 AM
Cream
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZiggyStardust
We definitely looked coached under LvG
Didn't work and the players weren't able to carry out what LvG wanted but it was clear what we were trying to do

The problem under Jose and Ole is I can't actually work out what we are trying to do on the pitch
If it was just a case of the players not being good enough to execute what Ole is asking them to do then you would still be able to see on the pitch what the plan is but sorry I can't

I actually fell sorry for some of our players, they look a bit lost
I think LVG had such an obvious philosh that it was easy for everyone to see what he was aiming for. Including opposition managers.

Maybe subsequent managers employ a more flexible tactical approach?

Under Mou I saw no plan. Under Ole I think I see a counter attacking plan but with more of the ball at times? No idea tbh.

When it's working, nobody cares about the strategy. When it ain't working, we look aimless, and everyone is rightly up in arms.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 09:53 AM
Patty_b
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cream
I think LVG had such an obvious philosh that it was easy for everyone to see what he was aiming for. Including opposition managers.

Maybe subsequent managers employ a more flexible tactical approach?

Under Mou I saw no plan. Under Ole I think I see a counter attacking plan but with more of the ball at times? No idea tbh.

When it's working, nobody cares about the strategy. When it ain't working, we look aimless, and everyone is rightly up in arms.
Sounds about right.

Yesterday could have been one of those awful dross performances served up under Jose. Two managers with different styles, same shite outcome.

I'd hate to be see Ole sacked.

I don't agree that he doesn't know what he's doing. He learned from the best of the best, he's got all his coaching badges and he did things with Molde that no-one has come close to doing before him. I'm sure he knows how to set up a football team.

And then if he is sacked, we would then have a squad made up of players bought by 5 different managers, four them sacked within two and a half years at the club, and a board reluctant to spend any more money without making it back on the shite we have first. Who the £#%&! do we expect to get in to take charge of that sinking shit-fest

Even if we had a choice of any manager in the world, who do we get?

Loads of United fans wanted Zidane last season ffs. £#%&! right off.

Maybe we get a manager who has won the Champions League once or twice? Well we've done that twice and then celebrated their inevitable sacking with enthusiasm after a couple of years.

Maybe a manager who has proved themselves by over-achieving in the Premier League with a shit squad? No thanks.

Maybe someone like Eddie Howe. But if Ole's lack of experience is a massive issue, then what the £#%&! has this @#%&! achieved? Only got his coaching badges and experience at Bournemouth ffs.

Maybe tempt Poch, the massive Argentine cry baby, to take the reigns. Although he's managed to take a better squad to below us in the table, so £#%&! him.

Stick with Ole I reckon, even if the board don't.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 09:57 AM
AK14
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patty_b
Sounds about right.

Yesterday could have been one of those awful dross performances served up under Jose. Two managers with different styles, same shite outcome.

I'd hate to be see Ole sacked.

I don't agree that he doesn't know what he's doing. He learned from the best of the best, he's got all his coaching badges and he did things with Molde that no-one has come close to doing before him. I'm sure he knows how to set up a football team.

And then if he is sacked, we would then have a squad made up of players bought by 5 different managers, four them sacked within two and a half years at the club, and a board reluctant to spend any more money without making it back on the shite we have first. Who the £#%&! do we expect to get in to take charge of that sinking shit-fest

Even if we had a choice of any manager in the world, who do we get?

Loads of United fans wanted Zidane last season ffs. £#%&! right off.

Maybe we get a manager who has won the Champions League once or twice? Well we've done that twice and then celebrated their inevitable sacking with enthusiasm after a couple of years.

Maybe a manager who has proved themselves by over-achieving in the Premier League with a shit squad? No thanks.

Maybe someone like Eddie Howe. But if Ole's lack of experience is a massive issue, then what the £#%&! has this @#%&! achieved? Only got his coaching badges and experience at Bournemouth ffs.

Maybe tempt Poch, the massive Argentine cry baby, to take the reigns. Although he's managed to take a better squad to below us in the table, so £#%&! him.

Stick with Ole I reckon, even if the board don't.
Christ when you say it like that

And there are still people blaming the managers more than the owners and Woodward
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:00 AM
windy waffles
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AK14
Christ when you say it like that

And there are still people blaming the managers more than the owners and Woodward
To be fair, who is training the players on the pitch? It isn't Woodward is it?

Got to look at the players. They're the useless @#%&!s not performing week in week out regardless of who the manager is.

Fold the club.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:01 AM
Alex Jones was Right
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patty_b
This has been said about the squad for the past few years, regardless as to who the manager is. There's something wrong with the team, like they're un-coachable or something.

Imo the players have been treated like spoilt little @#%&!s for too long.

Mou was a toxic £#%&!er, but anytime he criticised or put pressure on the players privately, there was always leaks to the press and he was lambasted for it as a horrible bully. Call me an old fashioned mentalist, but I believe that if a manager can't even criticise one of their own players without worrying about their job, then they're pretty £#%&!ed no matter what.

There's no solid leadership in the dressing room, there seems to be a complete lack of respect for anyone who manages the team and the senior staff (outside of media soundbites). There's a complete lack of team ethic and collective responsibility in the squad.

The dressing room is a collective of overpaid has-beens, never-will-be's, and @#%&!s who couldn't care less one way or another, barring the three summer signing's.

I want Ole to stay, to grab the squad by the collar and shake the shit literally out of the dressing room, and be backed to bring in some leadership and collective 'will to win'.

Instead I think he will be sacked and it will be business as usual for the foreseeable future.
Agreed.

The players used to ignore van gaal’s attempts to improve them. Mourinho used to have shouting matches with Pogba because he wouldn’t do what he was told on the pitch. This is the battle any manager has to win before the football improves as we want. The only way to do that is exactly what ole is doing. Getting rid of the bad attitudes and bringing in quality players with good ones.

We have to take the hit and be patient until that has been done. Otherwise it will never be sorted and we’ll be stuck on this perpetual 2 year managerial cycle with each one looking for short term fixes as the players rule the roost. Anyone who thinks a big name manager like Allegri will make a difference is deluding themselves.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazlo Panaflex
Long story short. Ole is here for 2 more seasons. Well be in the market for a new manager around January 2022
If he’s here two more seasons, we won’t need a new manager.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:04 AM
rustling jimmies
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AK14
Christ when you say it like that

And there are still people blaming the managers more than the owners and Woodward
Its not as if the managers haven't been backed ffs, they have all just wasted on overpaid shite like Sanchez and Pogba.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:04 AM
Alex Jones was Right
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack Duckworth
let's face it, if two of the greatest managers of the modern era (moyes and lvg) couldn't do the job, then ole was on a hiding to nothing.
Tbf he’s already done two things they couldn’t. Get rid of players we’ve been crying out for years to get rid of, and he’s actually signed some players who’ve improved on what we had. Those two of the ‘greatest’ managers should be embarrassed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by windy waffles
I love Ole but he doesn't have a clue. Having said clue is a fundamental part of being a good manager, unfortunately.
You don’t have enough of a clue to judge whether he has a clue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rustling jimmies
Its not as if the managers haven't been backed ffs, they have all just wasted on overpaid shite like Sanchez and Pogba.
There’s more than one way to back a manager.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:10 AM
AK14
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jammy Dodger
Tbf he’s already done two things they couldn’t. Get rid of players we’ve been crying out for years to get rid of, and he’s actually signed some players who’ve improved on what we had. Those two of the ‘greatest’ managers should be embarrassed.
Has he?

Darmian and ?

Young, Rojo, Jones are still here and getting games

Smalling and Sanchez are only out on loan (Inter have an agreement to buy I think?)

The club have balanced the books more than Ole clearing the decks tbh.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:10 AM
rustling jimmies
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jammy Dodger
Tbf he’s already done two things they couldn’t. Get rid of players we’ve been crying out for years to get rid of, and he’s actually signed some players who’ve improved on what we had. Those two of the ‘greatest’ managers should be embarrassed.



You don’t have enough of a clue to judge whether he has a clue.



There’s more than one way to back a manager.
Worked well for Pep and Klopp tbh
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:11 AM
Alex Jones was Right
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AK14
Has he?

Darmian and ?

Young, Rojo, Jones are still here and getting games

Smalling and Sanchez are only out on loan (Inter have an agreement to buy I think?)

The club have balanced the books more than Ole clearing the decks tbh.
%@#$&!s.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:11 AM
AK14
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jammy Dodger
There’s more than one way to back a manager.
Completely agree with that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jammy Dodger
%@#$&!s.
Great reply that...

And it’s not.

Smalling will be back here next summer and let’s not forget jones, young and mata have all been given new contracts under Ole.

Van Gaal cleared the decks of shit too btw.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:17 AM
windy waffles
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jammy Dodger

You don’t have enough of a clue to judge whether he has a clue.



.
You're an idiot and a poor excuse for a biscuit.

Get back in the tin.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:22 AM
Alex Jones was Right
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by windy waffles
You're an idiot and a poor excuse for a biscuit.

Get back in the tin.
When I say you, I should have said we. None of us have enough of a clue to judge.

The fans are already repeating the pattern of behaviour with ole that they have done for every single manager since fergie. And no doubt for every manager we will get in future as we go around in circles. The fans are every bit as toxic as the players and owners. Spoilt, fickle and entitled.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:23 AM
windy waffles
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jammy Dodger
When I say you, I should have said we. None of us have enough of a clue to judge.

The fans are already repeating the pattern of behaviour with ole that they have done for every single manager since fergie. And no doubt for every manager we will get in future as we go around in circles. The fans are every bit as toxic as the players and owners.
Apology accepted.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:27 AM
Alex Jones was Right
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AK14
Completely agree with that.



Great reply that...

And it’s not.

Smalling will be back here next summer and let’s not forget jones, young and mata have all been given new contracts under Ole.

Van Gaal cleared the decks of shit too btw.
I’ve already replied to you about the loans elsewhere.

Van gaal cleared the decks. He also added back a heap load of new shit. His signings addressed zero weaknesses they were bought to address.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 10:36 AM
AK14
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jammy Dodger
I’ve already replied to you about the loans elsewhere.

Van gaal cleared the decks. He also added back a heap load of new shit. His signings addressed zero weaknesses they were bought to address.
Whether you’ve replied to me elsewhere or not, you keep trying to paint a picture that Ole is running things and wielding the axe, he isn’t. He’s sold a couple of players that were obviously surplus but has also over seen new contracts to he likes of Jones, Mata and Young.

With the way the club is run it’s far more likely the owners are balancing the books because we missed out on the champions league. That’s not having a pop at Ole, it’s being realistic.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 11:45 AM
Alex Jones was Right
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AK14
Whether you’ve replied to me elsewhere or not, you keep trying to paint a picture that Ole is running things and wielding the axe, he isn’t.
How do you know this?

I think giving out new contracts rather than letting them run out are a club policy regardless of manager, and they’re not signing as many players as he wanted, but I I doubt the club are signing or getting rid of players against his will. I have no doubt ole has final say on who comes and goes, even if he’s hampered by not being able to sign or get rid of as many as he’d like, as quickly as he’d like.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 11:46 AM
Sparky***
 
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The only things we've seen similar to this over the last 35 years are:

1) When Fergie took over in '86, briefly steadied the place and we finished 2nd in his first full season in '88. However he then got down to the business of stripping out the squad of all the old heads and we quickly plummeted down the table. Finished 11th in 1989 and then 13th in 1990, Just 5 points clear of relegation where you saw the now infamous "3 years and it's still crap tara" flag..FA cup win saved his job.

2) When Van Gaal came in post moyes and stripped away all the old guard leaving us in a similar state squad-wise as we are now. He finished 5th, won the FA Cup but was still binned off halfway through.

It's shit but the club really have to ride this one out and back the manager. We can't keep starting over every other year. It's gonna take 2-3 years to sort this and it needs to be done now.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 11:49 AM
dragflick
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparky***
The only things we've seen similar to this over the last 35 years are:

1) When Fergie took over in '86, briefly steadied the place and we finished 2nd in his first full season in '88. However he then got down to the business of stripping out the squad of all the old heads and we quickly plummeted down the table. Finished 11th in 1989 and then 13th in 1990, Just 5 points clear of relegation where you saw the now infamous "3 years and it's still crap tara" flag..FA cup win saved his job.

2) When Van Gaal came in post moyes and stripped away all the old guard leaving us in a similar state squad-wise as we are now. He finished 5th, won the FA Cup but was still binned off halfway through.

It's shit but the club really have to ride this one out and back the manager. We can't keep starting over every other year. It's gonna take 2-3 years to sort this and it needs to be done now.
Correct.
 
Unread 23-09-2019, 11:51 AM
dunk
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparky***
The only things we've seen similar to this over the last 35 years are:

1) When Fergie took over in '86, briefly steadied the place and we finished 2nd in his first full season in '88. However he then got down to the business of stripping out the squad of all the old heads and we quickly plummeted down the table. Finished 11th in 1989 and then 13th in 1990, Just 5 points clear of relegation where you saw the now infamous "3 years and it's still crap tara" flag..FA cup win saved his job.

2) When Van Gaal came in post moyes and stripped away all the old guard leaving us in a similar state squad-wise as we are now. He finished 5th, won the FA Cup but was still binned off halfway through.

It's shit but the club really have to ride this one out and back the manager. We can't keep starting over every other year. It's gonna take 2-3 years to sort this and it needs to be done now.
Yep.

This season is almost identical in it's set up to LvG's second season imo. Difference being our two most hated rivals are ripping the £#%&! out of it and making our current position all the more stark.

Have to leave Ole with it. It's still early days in his tenure, he's still wrestling with the cauldron of shit that is the squad he inherited and needs to be given time to grow with it and change the squad.
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