I met the ref assesor for the Chelsea game last night

His report on Martin Atkinson:
"Overall, a very good performance. The ref was only marked down for NOT booking Fletcher for constant complaining about decisions that went against him (7 occassions, should have been told off on 3rd and booked thereafter) and NOT sending off Jonny Evans for the studs in the chest of Drogba.
One linesman was downgraded for the wrong offside against Rooney."

He says the Fletcher / Cole tackle was discussed this week - it was a 50:50 split between the refs that watched it on calling it a foul or a good tackle. Nobody would have picked up on the foul on Jonny Evans in the build-up to the Terry goal, and as Drogba didn't touch the ball on the way in, they would have all said he was inactive and the goal should stand.

Most interesting comment though: "probably the best performance from Wayne Rooney, ever. Absolutely outstanding". This is from a ref that sent off Paul Gascoigne in his prime.

I asked him about Fletcher's fear that he's being targetted after the comments from Wenger, he says most refs are simply fed up with the entire United team moaning about every decision, so he shouldn't feel victimised.

Officially, Fergie's comments about Wiley and Atkinson won't have any impact, however it may backfire because now refs will have to be seen to apply the rules more strictly to both United and the opposition, which will result in more stoppages in play (which would be more detremental to United's play), more free-kicks (not very useful without a decent free-kick taker in the United team) and more bookings.

OH, HE THINKS JEFF WINTER IS A @#%&!!

What about our penalty?

Originally Posted by Charlie Harper

His report on Martin Atkinson:
"Overall, a very good performance. The ref was only marked down for NOT booking Fletcher for constant complaining about decisions that went against him (7 occassions, should have been told off on 3rd and booked thereafter) and NOT sending off Jonny Evans for the studs in the chest of Drogba.
One linesman was downgraded for the wrong offside against Rooney."

He says the Fletcher / Cole tackle was discussed this week - it was a 50:50 split between the refs that watched it on calling it a foul or a good tackle. Nobody would have picked up on the foul on Jonny Evans in the build-up to the Terry goal, and as Drogba didn't touch the ball on the way in, they would have all said he was inactive and the goal should stand.

Most interesting comment though: "probably the best performance from Wayne Rooney, ever. Absolutely outstanding". This is from a ref that sent off Paul Gascoigne in his prime.

I asked him about Fletcher's fear that he's being targetted after the comments from Wenger, he says most refs are simply fed up with the entire United team moaning about every decision, so he shouldn't feel victimised.

Officially, Fergie's comments about Wiley and Atkinson won't have any impact, however it may backfire because now refs will have to be seen to apply the rules more strictly to both United and the opposition, which will result in more stoppages in play (which would be more detremental to United's play), more free-kicks (not very useful without a decent free-kick taker in the United team) and more bookings.

OH, HE THINKS JEFF WINTER IS A @#%&!!

That's extremely £#%&!ing worrying.

He got the ball cleanly, and Cole threw himself up in the air.

The usual excuse that "refs don't get the benefit of the replay" is negated slightly when they DO get a replay and still can't call it correctly.

And yeah, what about the penalty on Valencia?

Also, what about the ref letting Chelsea continue with their attack when Terry was down injured, but stopping the game as soon as United got the ball back?


And he should have sent Jonny Evans off? £#%&!ing hell, Drogba fouled Evans. No attempt to play the ball, through himself into Evans and came off worse. Got booked for his troubles. One of the few calls the ref got spot on.

Originally Posted by Charlie Harper

His report on Martin Atkinson:
"Overall, a very good performance. The ref was only marked down for NOT booking Fletcher for constant complaining about decisions that went against him (7 occassions, should have been told off on 3rd and booked thereafter) and NOT sending off Jonny Evans for the studs in the chest of Drogba.
One linesman was downgraded for the wrong offside against Rooney."

He says the Fletcher / Cole tackle was discussed this week - it was a 50:50 split between the refs that watched it on calling it a foul or a good tackle. Nobody would have picked up on the foul on Jonny Evans in the build-up to the Terry goal, and as Drogba didn't touch the ball on the way in, they would have all said he was inactive and the goal should stand.

Most interesting comment though: "probably the best performance from Wayne Rooney, ever. Absolutely outstanding". This is from a ref that sent off Paul Gascoigne in his prime.

I asked him about Fletcher's fear that he's being targetted after the comments from Wenger, he says most refs are simply fed up with the entire United team moaning about every decision, so he shouldn't feel victimised.

Officially, Fergie's comments about Wiley and Atkinson won't have any impact, however it may backfire because now refs will have to be seen to apply the rules more strictly to both United and the opposition, which will result in more stoppages in play (which would be more detremental to United's play), more free-kicks (not very useful without a decent free-kick taker in the United team) and more bookings.

OH, HE THINKS JEFF WINTER IS A @#%&!!

Assuming this is no WUM does that mean Evans will be punished after the event?

I'd imagie it would have been done by now and anyway the refereee saw it so they can't so anything about it.

Originally Posted by Charlie Harper

His report on Martin Atkinson:
"Overall, a very good performance. The ref was only marked down for NOT booking Fletcher for constant complaining about decisions that went against him (7 occassions, should have been told off on 3rd and booked thereafter) and NOT sending off Jonny Evans for the studs in the chest of Drogba.
One linesman was downgraded for the wrong offside against Rooney."

He says the Fletcher / Cole tackle was discussed this week - it was a 50:50 split between the refs that watched it on calling it a foul or a good tackle. Nobody would have picked up on the foul on Jonny Evans in the build-up to the Terry goal, and as Drogba didn't touch the ball on the way in, they would have all said he was inactive and the goal should stand.

Most interesting comment though: "probably the best performance from Wayne Rooney, ever. Absolutely outstanding". This is from a ref that sent off Paul Gascoigne in his prime.

I asked him about Fletcher's fear that he's being targetted after the comments from Wenger, he says most refs are simply fed up with the entire United team moaning about every decision, so he shouldn't feel victimised.

Officially, Fergie's comments about Wiley and Atkinson won't have any impact, however it may backfire because now refs will have to be seen to apply the rules more strictly to both United and the opposition, which will result in more stoppages in play (which would be more detremental to United's play), more free-kicks (not very useful without a decent free-kick taker in the United team) and more bookings.

OH, HE THINKS JEFF WINTER IS A @#%&!!

so after watching it over and over again...the blind @#%&!s didnt realise it was Wez Brown that had been pulled to the floor

Originally Posted by Pete's Shoes

Assuming this is no WUM does that mean Evans will be punished after the event?

The FA can't act retrospectively in that case as he called a foul (and booked Drogba). Evans had his foot stretched out in the direction of Drogba when they jumped, that is dangerous play and for that he should have gone.

I did ask about the pen, he shrugged and said it was another where both the linesman and the ref came to the decision that there was no foul. The assessor watches the game and the ref's position and actions, so he can miss stuff too. His complaint is he goes to a game but doesn't get to see the game.

The usual excuse that "refs don't get the benefit of the replay" is negated slightly when they DO get a replay and still can't call it correctly.

I've watched a replay of that incident 10 times, and I can't say that I wouldn't have thought it was a foul if I had only seen it once in real-time. The ball doesn't go off one one direction as it would if it were a "clean" tackle, so it looks like a collision of bodies, even if the contact that was made was after the ball was won.

I'm not saying I agree with his analysis. I watched the game on TV and thought there were 10 decisions that went against United that were either just wrong or we didn't get the 50:50s. But United didn't get 3 points because United didn't score.

He did say that he thought United had the best play and probably would have scored a couple had the linesman kept his flag down against Rooney, as Chelsea were on the ropes at that point.

Are you a ref yourself Charlie? Interesting stuff that

Originally Posted by Charlie Harper

The FA can't act retrospectively in that case as he called a foul (and booked Drogba). Evans had his foot stretched out in the direction of Drogba when they jumped, that is dangerous play and for that he should have gone.

I did ask about the pen, he shrugged and said it was another where both the linesman and the ref came to the decision that there was no foul. The assessor watches the game and the ref's position and actions, so he can miss stuff too. His complaint is he goes to a game but doesn't get to see the game.



I've watched a replay of that incident 10 times, and I can't say that I wouldn't have thought it was a foul if I had only seen it once in real-time. The ball doesn't go off one one direction as it would if it were a "clean" tackle, so it looks like a collision of bodies, even if the contact that was made was after the ball was won.

I'm not saying I agree with his analysis. I watched the game on TV and thought there were 10 decisions that went against United that were either just wrong or we didn't get the 50:50s. But United didn't get 3 points because United didn't score.

He did say that he thought United had the best play and probably would have scored a couple had the linesman kept his flag down against Rooney, as Chelsea were on the ropes at that point.

Yes, but on the replay it IS clear that Fletcher got the ball cleanly and Cole dived. That the refs were 50/50 inspite of having seen the reply is extremely worrying and serves to negate the "they don't have the benefit of a replay" argument. Even with a replay half the @#%&!s are clueless.

Did they mention the time-keeping?

A minimum of 5 minutes to be played, a substitution made in those 5 extra minutes and he blows bang on the 5 minutes extra.

Surely that's downright incompetence.

Maybe you're right, it's not the 10 decisions that wrongly went against us, or indeed the majority of the 50:50s, we didn't get any points because we didn't score.

We also didn't get the required amount of time to try and score did we.

I have a feeling we're going to start dishing out some thrashings over the next half a dozen games or so.

I like the way people try to reason "United didn't deserve to win because they didn't score".

It's hard enough to score at Chelsea (not conceded at home since Hull on first day of the seaosn), but when you have a stone wall penalty turned down and Rooney called wrongly offside when clean through on goal I'd imagine it's even harder to get the ball in the back of the @#%&!ing net.

Then you get refs (Jeff Winter and Graham Poll) coming out and saying that, whether or not Fletcher fouled Cole, United were at fault for not defending the freekick properly! £#%&!ing hell. Next time a ref gives a penalty incorrectly will they blame the keeper for not saving it? @#%&!s.

Originally Posted by Terry Silver

I like the way people try to reason "United didn't deserve to win because they didn't score".

It's hard enough to score at Chelsea (not conceded at home since Hull on first day of the seaosn), but when you have a stone wall penalty turned down and Rooney called wrongly offside when clean through on goal I'd imagine it's even harder to get the ball in the back of the @#%&!ing net.

Then you get refs (Jeff Winter and Graham Poll) coming out and saying that, whether or not Fletcher fouled Cole, United were at fault for not defending the freekick properly! £#%&!ing hell. Next time a ref gives a penalty incorrectly will they blame the keeper for not saving it? @#%&!s.

Bang on the money that. That's 2 clear goalscoring opportunities denied by shite refereeing.

Originally Posted by wiganste

Bang on the money that. That's 2 clear goalscoring opportunities denied by shite refereeing.

In one game, how many throughout the season?

Pete's Shoes
Are you a ref yourself Charlie? Interesting stuff that

I started the course the decade ago, but stopped when I moved, and it turns out by pure co-incidence that one of my neighbours is the assessor (in the original post) and a very prominant ex-ref.

A few mates have been wearing black for over a decade: one did the course but never took any games - just to get tickets to the FA Cup Final; one is doing County games just to keep fit, another was very promising but left: he was runing the line in a Conference game 5-6 years ago and at half-time, had a go at the ref for being unfit and getting a lot of decisions wrong. My mate got scored a 2/10 for his contribution, so he complained that he was being downgraded out of spite. When the FA did £#%&! all, he quit - the FA are struggling to keep hold of anyone who wants to do the job so didn't want to cause any trouble. As it turns out, the ref my mate complained about is now doing Championship games and is expcted to make Premier League in 1-2 years. :shakehead:

I am happy that I know the rules as it makes it easy to ignore a lot of the bullshit that gets written and broadcast by so-called professionals. The book only costs a couple of quid and if I ruled the world, nobody would by allowed to watch the game without passing a test in the laws. That way, we wouldn't have the likes of Jamie Redknapp, Andy Grey, Alan Green, Spoony et al, not to mention the morons that call in to Five Live.

thanks for the post. i thought it was a great read

I still don't agree you can blame the linesman for offside decision. it was touch and go. as rooney was running through the defense, cole was stepping. its very difficult to see the ball, defensive line and the attackers at the same time. even with a second's difference, it always appears that attackers are in offside position and hence practically always benefit of doubt lies with defenders.

Originally Posted by rafabio

I still don't agree you can blame the linesman for offside decision. it was touch and go. as rooney was running through the defense, cole was stepping. its very difficult to see the ball, defensive line and the attackers at the same time. even with a second's difference, it always appears that attackers are in offside position and hence practically always benefit of doubt lies with defenders.

cole was on the linesman side

hth

I love it how refs are fed up with the United players for always complaining even though there are loads of teams worse than United for complaining to refs all the time.