Juan Mata - our new No.10

Originally Posted by AK14

Has he?

I’ll take your word for it pal.

Still doesn’t make sense to me for the club to give a 31yr old player who’s not exactly a world beater and doesn’t seem to fit well into the way we want to play under Ole a new 3 yr contract just because he might fancy being a coach one day.

If it’s not with coaching in mind and instead some %@#$&!s ambassadorial role then that’s a different matter, enough £#%&!ers on the gravy train as it is, don’t need another.

And tbf nobody has much idea of what way Ole wants to play. I certainly don’t see bringing a player of Mata’s quality off the bench as too much of an issue though, however we set up initially

Originally Posted by Ethers

If it’s not with coaching in mind and instead some %@#$&!s ambassadorial role then that’s a different matter, enough £#%&!ers on the gravy train as it is, don’t need another.

And tbf nobody has much of what way Ole wants to play. I certainly don’t see bringing a player of Mata’s quality off the bench as too much of an issue though, however we set up initially

What way is that out of interest? I don't even think he knows.

Agree re Mata, though. No issue with keeping him.

Originally Posted by Ethers

If it’s not with coaching in mind and instead some %@#$&!s ambassadorial role then that’s a different matter, enough £#%&!ers on the gravy train as it is, don’t need another.

And tbf nobody has much of what way Ole wants to play. I certainly don’t see bringing a player of Mata’s quality off the bench as too much of an issue though, however we set up initially

Yep and that’s my worry, especially with how we’re run these days.

I think he wants us to play a high energy game as he’s mentioned being extremely fit, which perhaps means a high pressing game? I’m not sure Mata is the right man for that type of gameplan long term?

Like I say, I wouldn’t really have had an issue with a year contract with an option of an extra year. But if what I’ve been reading is true and it’s a three year contract then imo it’s poor decision.

If we’re looking for players to come off the bench I’d much rather see how one of the three young kids do tbh, hopefully like you say they’ll still get plenty of game time so we know if they’re ever going to be good enough.

Originally Posted by windy waffles

What way is that out of interest? I don't even think he knows.

Agree re Mata, though. No issue with keeping him.

I missed out the word idea in there, fixed now. That’s exactly the point I was trying to make.

Originally Posted by AK14

Yep and that’s my worry, especially with how we’re run these days.

I think he wants us to play a high energy game as he’s mentioned being extremely fit, which perhaps means a high pressing game? I’m not sure Mata is the right man for that type of gameplan long term?

Like I say, I wouldn’t really have had an issue with a year contract with an option of an extra year. But if what I’ve been reading is true and it’s a three year contract then imo it’s poor decision.

If we’re looking for players to come off the bench I’d much rather see how one of the three young kids do tbh, hopefully like you say they’ll still get plenty of game time so we know if they’re ever going to be good enough.

Even if it's not his initial plan, it's always good to have options pal. Mata isn't as bad as people are making out. In fact, he's probably been our our best post Fergie signing. I know that doesn't say a lot but still...

Bar the odd free kick, what quality does Mata bring us exactly?

He doesn't take the initiative or dominate games, he doesn't go past players, he's just another on our list of useless players other than his free kicks.

It's funny that the young players need to prove they're worthy to get chances, whereas the experienced players get endless chances despite proving they're ****.

4 different managers now, consistent failure with a consistent core of players who are rewarded with new contracts again and again.

Originally Posted by AK14

Yep and that’s my worry, especially with how we’re run these days.

I think he wants us to play a high energy game as he’s mentioned being extremely fit, which perhaps means a high pressing game? I’m not sure Mata is the right man for that type of gameplan long term?

Like I say, I wouldn’t really have had an issue with a year contract with an option of an extra year. But if what I’ve been reading is true and it’s a three year contract then imo it’s poor decision.

If we’re looking for players to come off the bench I’d much rather see how one of the three young kids do tbh, hopefully like you say they’ll still get plenty of game time so we know if they’re ever going to be good enough.

If that is how he intends to play, then having someone like Mata to come off the bench to give you a completely different option, someone who will slow things down a bit, or pick out a pass, does kind of make sense.

Agree 3 years seems excessive, which is why I kind of assumed it would almost be transitioning into a coaching role by the end of the 3 years. I could be wrong though

Originally Posted by Ranier Wolfcastle

Bar the odd free kick, what quality does Mata bring us exactly?

He doesn't take the initiative or dominate games, he doesn't go past players, he's just another on our list of useless players other than his free kicks.

It's funny that the young players need to prove they're worthy to get chances, whereas the experienced players get endless chances despite proving they're ****.

4 different managers now, consistent failure with a consistent core of players who are rewarded with new contracts again and again.

Which tells you all you need to know that it isn't down to the managers, it's down to the club who refuse to let them go and would rather keep them than spend money to replace them.

Originally Posted by windy waffles

Even if it's not his initial plan, it's always good to have options pal. Mata isn't as bad as people are making out. In fact, he's probably been our our best post Fergie signing. I know that doesn't say a lot but still...

Agree.

Like I said it’s the length of contract I have an issue with, mainly because we’ve been here before over the last 10 years (holding onto players far longer than we should have).

The worry is he was never that athletic in his prime and as we’ve seen over the last few years that’s the way the game has gone. More and more it’s about speed, high intensity, pressing. The thought of an ageing Juan Mata starting for United over the next few years is stuff of nightmares, even if he is a really nice bloke off the pitch.

The problem with the idea that if a young player is better than a senior player or is performing better then they will absolutely take their spot in the team is a bit naïve

Managers (especially those who have not established a firm grip of power at the club) will always be weary of upsetting senior players at the club
Dropping a senior pro for an 18 or 19 year old is nearly always going to put the senior players nose out of joint and if he is an influential member of the dressing room it could cause problems

Originally Posted by Ethers

If that is how he intends to play, then having someone like Mata to come off the bench to give you a completely different option, someone who will slow things down a bit, or pick out a pass, does kind of make sense.

Agree 3 years seems excessive, which is why I kind of assumed it would almost be transitioning into a coaching role by the end of the 3 years. I could be wrong though

Possibly.

Hopefully Gomes does get game time next season and he proves he can take Mata’s spot in the squad for that type of player.

The biggest positive is like you say he’s seems like a sound bloke and good role model for the kids, so perhaps a future in coaching wouldn’t be a bad idea.

The club will obviously try and convince him he’d be best as an ambassador speaking at functions while making Jesse Lingard the youth team manager though

Originally Posted by AK14

Possibly.

Hopefully Gomes does get game time next season and he proves he can take Mata’s spot in the squad for that type of player.

The biggest positive is like you say he’s seems like a sound bloke and good role model for the kids, so perhaps a future in coaching wouldn’t be a bad idea.

The club will obviously try and convince him he’d be best as an ambassador speaking at functions while making Jesse Lingard the youth team manager though

He will do but at Ipswich.

Not good enough and too small.

Who’s made up this 3 year contract btw. Not a chance it’ll be 3 years

Originally Posted by puressence

Who’s made up this 3 year contract btw. Not a chance it’ll be 3 years

https://www.theguardian.com/football...chester-united

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/footb...fficult-talks/

https://www.espn.co.uk/football/socc...eing-mata-deal

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/48683833

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...act-extension/

Some have said three years and others have just said multi year. We’ll have to wait for the official club announcement to know for sure. My guess is it’ll be a two year contract with an option of the extra year.


Also just seen this...

https://twitter.com/simonpeach/status/1141070757784707072?s=21

This bloke reliable?

Originally Posted by AK14

https://www.theguardian.com/football...chester-united

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/footb...fficult-talks/

https://www.espn.co.uk/football/socc...eing-mata-deal

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/48683833

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...act-extension/

Some have said three years and others have just said multi year. We’ll have to wait for the official club announcement to know for sure. My guess is it’ll be a two year contract with an option of the extra year.


Also just seen this...

https://twitter.com/simonpeach/statu...784707072?s=21

This bloke reliable?

Hopefully not.

International relations position ffs. Pointless.

Originally Posted by AK14

I’m not suggesting we sell players that will be starting week in and week out, I’m suggesting not extending the contract of a 31 yr old fringe player for three years.

Why would we have bought a player to replace a fringe player when we could use the promising kids to sit on the bench?

You’re allowed plenty of subs these days. If they’re good enough, they’ll get their chances. The club don’t usually give any 31 year old a 3 year deal, so I doubt they have this time unless there’s some ulterior motive such as keeping de gea happy, or helping mend the supposed split in the squad over the foreign players thinking the English players have been given special treatment with contract renewals.

Originally Posted by AK14

https://www.theguardian.com/football...chester-united

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/footb...fficult-talks/

https://www.espn.co.uk/football/socc...eing-mata-deal

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/48683833

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football...act-extension/

Some have said three years and others have just said multi year. We’ll have to wait for the official club announcement to know for sure. My guess is it’ll be a two year contract with an option of the extra year.


Also just seen this...

https://twitter.com/simonpeach/statu...784707072?s=21

This bloke reliable?

The ambassador role been rumoured for months reckon it’ll be a year option another one after like most after 30s get

Originally Posted by Ranier Wolfcastle

Bar the odd free kick, what quality does Mata bring us exactly?

He makes runs, finds space and gets in behind the defence more than the likes of martial who should be doing that job. Who’s to say what influence he has on certain sections of the squad. A squad that was supposed to have been split due to Woodward’s contract renewals.

Originally Posted by ZiggyStardust

The problem with the idea that if a young player is better than a senior player or is performing better then they will absolutely take their spot in the team is a bit naïve

Managers (especially those who have not established a firm grip of power at the club) will always be weary of upsetting senior players at the club
Dropping a senior pro for an 18 or 19 year old is nearly always going to put the senior players nose out of joint and if he is an influential member of the dressing room it could cause problems

Fergie never did it by dropping senior pros. It was always injuries that lead to an opportunity, and usually a young player being played out of position. You could argue Phil Neville’s development was hampered by Fergie never dropping Irwin, because Neville was brilliant when he first got in the first team.

That’s how it happens. A young player just has to impress and when opportunities arise, take them and impress further until the manager is convinced the more senior player can be ditched.

Is Butragueño universally admired? I think people see him as the personification of ruthless Real Madrid. His nickname is The Vulture

Class player he was though.

Originally Posted by Jammy Dodger

He makes runs, finds space and gets in behind the defence more than the likes of martial who should be doing that job. Who’s to say what influence he has on certain sections of the squad. A squad that was supposed to have been split due to Woodward’s contract renewals.



Fergie never did it by dropping senior pros. It was always injuries that lead to an opportunity, and usually a young player being played out of position. You could argue Phil Neville’s development was hampered by Fergie never dropping Irwin, because Neville was brilliant when he first got in the first team.

That’s how it happens. A young player just has to impress and when opportunities arise, take them and impress further until the manager is convinced the more senior player can be ditched.

These kids are back ups for the back ups

There’s needs to be a route to the first team and that means stop giving past it fringe players new long term contracts. Give one or two talented kids a chance as fringe players instead of sticking by the players that have underachieved for so long.

I’d much rather see Chong, Greenwood or Gomes come on for the last 15 minutes of a game or start league cup matches a lot more than watching Mata plod around the pitch tbh.