Paul "the crock" Pogba

Originally Posted by dunk

Pogba mate.

He was shit last night, and at Brighton, but he wasn’t the worst on either occasion and he was bloody good against Leicester, after which came the much denied bust up.

It’s a poisonous place, the manager needs £#%&!ing off and the air clearing.

Not being the worst isn’t really the problem. It’s been his attitude. As you say, he was excellent 1st game, then he unnecessarily went to the press to stir up trouble. He should have made sure he was at his best these last couple of games. Deserves all the flak he is getting

Originally Posted by dunk

Right not to give him first team guarantees at 18, yes, but he wanted him to stay.

Truth be told, fat slug of an agent aside, the lad seems to have done well and been well liked everywhere he’s been until playing for Mourinho.

He played in a one team league who have won the double four seasons in a row, he'd have to do well not to be liked in that environment.

Fergie wasn't afraid to play young players if he thought they were ready, that he preferred to throw in Rafael and Park ahead of him was as much a commentary on Pogba as it was on any perceived conservative management. Fergie wasn't convinced by Pogba and it's easy to see why.

Originally Posted by Jammy Dodger

Personally I think the majority of united’s signings since fergie retired have been driven by Woodward using a combination of the club’s scout lists and agent influence. He’s effectively director of football, deciding who comes in and who leaves with no regard for dressing room dynamics.

But you have no proof of that. I’d say, given the personalities of both Van Gaal and Mourinho and the fact that we solicited both, that it’s unlikely they stood idly by while this know nothing foisted players they didn’t want on them.

Originally Posted by Kangared

Not being the worst isn’t really the problem. It’s been his attitude. As you say, he was excellent 1st game, then he unnecessarily went to the press to stir up trouble. He should have made sure he was at his best these last couple of games. Deserves all the flak he is getting

This, one suspects part of his problem is that he only listens to sycophants who just tell him that he is brilliant and has already "made it".

Originally Posted by Kangared

Not being the worst isn’t really the problem. It’s been his attitude. As you say, he was excellent 1st game, then he unnecessarily went to the press to stir up trouble. He should have made sure he was at his best these last couple of games. Deserves all the flak he is getting

Sorry who are we talking about this time out of Poggers or Mou Mou?

Originally Posted by red in cumbria

This, one suspects part of his problem is that he only listens to sycophants who just tell him that he is brilliant and has already "made it".

Those same sycophants would buzz around every rich player if they could. Only the mentally weak indulge them.

Scholes has stated on numerous occasions that he saw nothing in Pogba that would have warranted the sorts of guarantees his agent was looking for. Didn’t dispute his potential at all, just that this talk of him being the obvious next great thing was made up.

Good teams make Pogba look great. He’s not the requisite quality to improve others around him.

Originally Posted by red in cumbria

This, one suspects part of his problem is that he only listens to sycophants who just tell him that he is brilliant and has already "made it".

Don’t think the circus around him signing for us did anything to quell his ego

Originally Posted by Kangared

Don’t think the circus around him signing for us did anything to quell his ego

but it sure did drive followers and likes nqat

Originally Posted by Kangared

Don’t think the circus around him signing for us did anything to quell his ego

You're doing this on purpose aren't you?

Originally Posted by andyroo

Sorry who are we talking about this time out of Poggers or Mou Mou?

not sure anymore , I’m confused

I still believe there is an outrageously good footballer in him but it's based on the same belief two years ago when we brought him back, and seven years ago when he was in that FA Youth Cup winning team with Morrison and Januzaj.

This is based on the fact he has so much to offer. He has the physical presence to overpower opponents. He has fantastic technique and quick feet for a big man. He has the feet of an elegant winger at times in terms of getting out of tight areas. How many other players actually have that mix of attributes?

Tottenham have a player who has similar qualities in Dembele but he's not a player who penetrates opponents. He's the guy the others give the ball too because he is so hard to dispossess. He's the guy that keeps things ticking over. He's the guy that brings calmness to enable the others to thrive. I know people want Pogba to simplify his game and there are elements he can pick up from Dembele. Most obvious is knowing when to take players on and when not to. Be more willing to play short under pressure rather than acting like it's beneath him to defer to someone else. It's not about working harder, but more smarter. However I don't want Pogba's game to be stripped down to just doing simple things well. In our team Matic is the guy who facilitates others and who Pogba is not doing a worthy job of benefiting from.

It's the balance he found at Juventus and for France. At Juventus he had senior pros in Vidal, Pirlo and Marchisio looking after him and possibly with Serie A being a slower (and easier) league he grew bad habits in what should have been his developmental years. For France however he found the balance with Kante and Matuidi and one of the plus sides of Pogba's tournament was how he was willing to be a team cog. Perhaps because it's the World Cup. The biggest tournament on the planet and that's the stage he feels is befitting of it - not away at Brighton or West Brom at home.

Originally Posted by Buck

I still believe there is an outrageously good footballer in him but it's based on the same belief two years ago when we brought him back, and seven years ago when he was in that FA Youth Cup winning team with Morrison and Januzaj.

This is based on the fact he has so much to offer. He has the physical presence to overpower opponents. He has fantastic technique and quick feet for a big man. He has the feet of an elegant winger at times in terms of getting out of tight areas. How many other players actually have that mix of attributes?

Tottenham have a player who has similar qualities in Dembele but he's not a player who penetrates opponents. He's the guy the others give the ball too because he is so hard to dispossess. He's the guy that keeps things ticking over. He's the guy that brings calmness to enable the others to thrive. I know people want Pogba to simplify his game and there are elements he can pick up from Dembele. Most obvious is knowing when to take players on and when not to. Be more willing to play short under pressure rather than acting like it's beneath him to defer to someone else. It's not about working harder, but more smarter. However I don't want Pogba's game to be stripped down to just doing simple things well. In our team Matic is the guy who facilitates others and who Pogba is not doing a worthy job of benefiting from.

It's the balance he found at Juventus and for France. At Juventus he had senior pros in Vidal, Pirlo and Marchisio looking after him and possibly with Serie A being a slower (and easier) league he grew bad habits in what should have been his developmental years. For France however he found the balance with Kante and Matuidi and one of the plus sides of Pogba's tournament was how he was willing to be a team cog. Perhaps because it's the World Cup. The biggest tournament on the planet and that's the stage he feels is befitting of it - not away at Brighton or West Brom at home.

[/Riccers] Januzaj wasn’t in that team. Lingard was tho’. [/Riccers]

Other than that, a decent post.

Originally Posted by dragflick

[/Riccers] Januzaj wasn’t in that team. Lingard was tho’. [/Riccers]

Other than that, a decent post.

Originally Posted by dunk

Right not to give him first team guarantees at 18, yes, but he wanted him to stay.

Truth be told, fat slug of an agent aside, the lad seems to have done well and been well liked everywhere he’s been until playing for Mourinho.

You talk as if the French manager hasn’t had the same issues with him mourinho has.

Originally Posted by utd99

But you have no proof of that. I’d say, given the personalities of both Van Gaal and Mourinho and the fact that we solicited both, that it’s unlikely they stood idly by while this know nothing foisted players they didn’t want on them.

There’s plenty of circumstantial evidence. The reported commercially motivated transfer strategy of the club the glazers and Woodward wanted after Fergie retired. The actual signings which follow that reported strategy. Recent comments by Brian McClair and Andy mitten. Various comments by Arnold and various leaks by Woodward to the media. There’s plenty of smoke.

In case you haven’t noticed mourinho hasn’t stood idly by. He’s been fighting woodward tooth and nail, which is why he’s on the brink.

Originally Posted by Kangared

Don’t think the circus around him signing for us did anything to quell his ego

According to Woodward we’re disneyland for adults. According to Arnold or some other suit, we’re the greatest soap opera in the world. Or words to that effect. A circus with numerous George clooneys is what they want.

Originally Posted by Buck

For France however he found the balance with Kante and Matuidi and one of the plus sides of Pogba's tournament was how he was willing to be a team cog. Perhaps because it's the World Cup. The biggest tournament on the planet and that's the stage he feels is befitting of it - not away at Brighton or West Brom at home.

No perhaps about it. The manager held the power in that equation. Do what he’s supposed to do or miss out. Pogba has the power over the manager at united. Any manager. With Woodward holding power and dictating strategy, any new manager will have to pander and indulge the commercially valuable assets. It’s no longer a job for the fergies or mourinhos. It’s the pochettinos, ancellottis and zidanes of this world doing a short term cycle pandering egos until the players turn. A team with 5 galacticos running the show wins European cups apparently. Real Madrid is our template.

Originally Posted by Jammy Dodger

You talk as if the French manager hasn’t had the same issues with him mourinho has.



There’s plenty of circumstantial evidence. The reported commercially motivated transfer strategy of the club the glazers and Woodward wanted after Fergie retired. The actual signings which follow that reported strategy. Recent comments by Brian McClair and Andy mitten. Various comments by Arnold and various leaks by Woodward to the media. There’s plenty of smoke.

In case you haven’t noticed mourinho hasn’t stood idly by. He’s been fighting woodward tooth and nail, which is why he’s on the brink.



According to Woodward we’re disneyland for adults. According to Arnold or some other suit, we’re the greatest soap opera in the world. Or words to that effect. A circus with numerous George clooneys is what they want.



No perhaps about it. The manager held the power in that equation. Do what he’s supposed to do or miss out. Pogba has the power over the manager at united. Any manager. With Woodward holding power and dictating strategy, any new manager will have to pander and indulge the commercially valuable assets. It’s no longer a job for the fergies or mourinhos. It’s the pochettinos, ancellottis and zidanes of this world doing a short term cycle pandering egos until the players turn. A team with 5 galacticos running the show wins European cups apparently. Real Madrid is our template.

The Madrid template wont work here because we never were and will never will be as attractive of a proposition as they.

The only reason city has talents, is due to Pep (a galactico on the touchline)- and honest, I don't see them turning over Barca or RM over two legs still at this level.

Wants to go back to Juve in january according to a few of the back pages.

Riola has obviously been briefing...

Bye.

Originally Posted by windy waffles

Wants to go back to Juve in january according to a few of the back pages.

Riola has obviously been briefing...

Bye.

I don't know if he's heard or not but Juve just kind of shelled out a lot of cash on someone...

Originally Posted by windy waffles

Wants to go back to Juve in january according to a few of the back pages.

Riola has obviously been briefing...

Bye.

no chance. He is too big for Juve now.

Needs a performance today.

Souness stumbles into the fray

“Paul Pogba plays for himself, it's all about how cool he looks, showing us how clever he is. I reckon Pogba's only in the team to maintain his transfer value until United can sell him, because he doesn't merit his place for any other reason," the Scotsman, a notorious midfield hardman in his playing days, told the Sunday Times.

“Perhaps we're now seeing the selfish player Fergie didn't fancy the first time round?”

Originally Posted by Cream

Souness stumbles into the fray

Absolutely bang on the money.....