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Unread 14-01-2019, 05:58 PM
ScarFace
 
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Unread 14-01-2019, 06:04 PM
red in cumbria
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Switching Off
I missed that one.
I have mentioned it before tbh, but it was over 20 years ago now. £#%&! me
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:06 PM
Sandman
 
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We'll know by the end of the season whether Ole is the right man to take us forward. That second half was terrible yesterday, we went far too deep, and were lucky to hold on. I don't know the reasons for it, and hope to christ it wasn't planned. I don't want to see us hanging on for dear life against anyone.

Other than that, it couldn't be going any better.
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:17 PM
utd99
 
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Originally Posted by S/Side.Red
You know what the Dutch style is. Everyone does. They're the biggest influence in the game's modern history, with their silly boxes etc.
Stupid comment tbh mate. So Michels, Cruyff, Van Gaal, Hiddink, Koeman, Gullitt, Rikjaard all coached the same style with the same emphasis yeah?

I could see anyone who came through the Ajax academy being heavily influenced by them, but outside of that it's utter nonsense to suggest just because someone shares a nationality that they don't have their own unique methodology and 'philosophy'. Van Gaal and Cruyff couldn't be more different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by S/Side.Red
Doubt it, pal. People who championed Mourinho are now crowing about Solskjaer being the anti-Mou. Bloody goalposts aots.
Mourinho was given his chance, as is right; he failed. Now we move on. Most reasonable people recognise this and don't feel the need to cling onto abject failures like they're an infant's blankee.
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:23 PM
Bunker Buster
 
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This isn't going to end well.....
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:24 PM
Lazlo Panaflex
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunker Buster
This isn't going to end well.....
Unfortunately so.
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:25 PM
red in cumbria
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunker Buster
This isn't going to end well.....
Wouldn't go that far, but I'm not getting carried away *just* yet.......
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:32 PM
Jack Duckworth
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vedder
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:32 PM
S/Side.Red
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by utd99
Stupid comment tbh mate. So Michels, Cruyff, Van Gaal, Hiddink, Koeman, Gullitt, Rikjaard all coached the same style with the same emphasis yeah?

I could see anyone who came through the Ajax academy being heavily influenced by them, but outside of that it's utter nonsense to suggest just because someone shares a nationality that they don't have their own unique methodology and 'philosophy'. Van Gaal and Cruyff couldn't be more different..
The last line is patently nonsense, but for the record "The Dutch style" doesn't mean that every Dutch coach works in the same way. It's a reference to the very clear ideas and methods that come from Holland that have influenced the game. I thought that was obvious.

Anyway, a lot of the 'risk' talk is just cultural differences. People in England can sometimes see holding the ball as cowardly. Other cultures see giving it away needlessly because you haven't got the balls to hold it as cowardly. As usual, the idea is to find the balance.
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:45 PM
utd99
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S/Side.Red
The last line is patently nonsense, but for the record "The Dutch style" doesn't mean that every Dutch coach works in the same way. It's a reference to the very clear ideas and methods that come from Holland that have influenced the game. I thought that was obvious.

Anyway, a lot of the 'risk' talk is just cultural differences. People in England can sometimes see holding the ball as cowardly. Other cultures see giving it away needlessly because you haven't got the balls to hold it as cowardly. As usual, the idea is to find the balance.
I don't know what any of this means. It's the footballing equivalent of David Brent explaining his cost cutting measures to Jennifer Taylor Clark. It sounds like you get your ideas on football from 'Inverting the Pyramid' rather than what you're watching mate.

When two styles of play are the literal opposite of each other how can you talk about 'The Dutch Style' as some sort of constant? I have news for you, no coach in the world, whether they're from Holland or Timbuktu, wants their players to give the ball away. The amount of risk you're willing to take in pursuit of creating chances and scoring goals vs perceived control through possession however varies massively. Were you watching the same games the rest of us were? It's not £#%&!ing cultural, it was endless cycling of the ball, getting nowhere and no shots on goal. My God.
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:47 PM
My Name is Keith
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

Anyway, a lot of the 'risk' talk is just cultural differences. People in England can sometimes see holding the ball as cowardly. Other cultures see giving it away needlessly because you haven't got the balls to hold it as cowardly. As usual, the idea is to find the balance.
No pal, knocking the ball endlessley sideways across the middle of the pitch against teams like villa at home and not moving it forward because to do so risks loss of possession is cowardly.

Keeping it, being effective with it and adapting your style and risk taking depending on the opposition is a different thing altogether obvs.
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:56 PM
S/Side.Red
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by My Name is Keith
No pal, knocking the ball endlessley sideways across the middle of the pitch against teams like villa at home and not moving it forward because to do so risks loss of possession is cowardly.

Keeping it, being effective with it and adapting your style and risk taking depending on the opposition is a different thing altogether obvs.
They move the ball side to side to move the opposition around to create space. That's literally the idea, and it's supposed to be done more quickly than the players managed it. The idea that it's because we're worried of giving the ball away to Villa is just
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:57 PM
Sparky***
 
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Today's absolute load of %@#$&!s at the BBC

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46858442
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:59 PM
S/Side.Red
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by utd99
I don't know what any of this means. It's the footballing equivalent of David Brent explaining his cost cutting measures to Jennifer Taylor Clark. It sounds like you get your ideas on football from 'Inverting the Pyramid' rather than what you're watching mate.

When two styles of play are the literal opposite of each other how can you talk about 'The Dutch Style' as some sort of constant? I have news for you, no coach in the world, whether they're from Holland or Timbuktu, wants their players to give the ball away. The amount of risk you're willing to take in pursuit of creating chances and scoring goals vs perceived control through possession however varies massively. Were you watching the same games the rest of us were? It's not £#%&!ing cultural, it was endless cycling of the ball, getting nowhere and no shots on goal. My God.
Again, it's not saying it's a constant. It's a reference to the notable principles and methods the Dutch brought that were popularised and influence just about every coach around at the top level right now. The extent to which LvG has influenced 90% would probably unsettle you also. It isn't the same as saying every Dutch person coaches the same ffs
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 06:59 PM
£#%&! KFC
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparky***
Today's absolute load of %@#$&!s at the BBC

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/46858442
Phil McWallpusher....couldn't fill a stamp with what he knows about anything the silly @#%&!
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 07:07 PM
My Name is Keith
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S/Side.Red
They move the ball side to side to move the opposition around to create space. That's literally the idea, and it's supposed to be done more quickly than the players managed it. The idea that it's because we're worried of giving the ball away to Villa is just
I know why they do it - but if you can’t do it effectively against villa et al then change your approach.

You’re a weird lad
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 07:13 PM
S/Side.Red
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by My Name is Keith
I know why they do it - but if you can’t do it effectively against villa et al then change your approach.

You’re a weird lad
Really didn't seem you did, given you said it was to avoid losing the ball against Villa etc.

Who knows if that side would have fared any better with a different approach tactically. Or if we needed more quality regardless.
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 07:21 PM
utd99
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by My Name is Keith
I know why they do it - but if you can’t do it effectively against villa et al then change your approach.
How? Haven't you heard about "The Dutch Style"?

QED, it had to be the player's fault. Shame he wasn't allowed to buy some new ones.
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 07:26 PM
My Name is Keith
 
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Originally Posted by S/Side.Red
Really didn't seem you did, given you said it was to avoid losing the ball against Villa etc.

Who knows if that side would have fared any better with a different approach tactically. Or if we needed more quality regardless.

City play that style effectively as we all know - I’m not saying it doesn’t work - we all know it can. It didn’t work with our players and our culture. Btw That team were more than capable of slotting villa at home

He imposed a radical change on a team and club incapable of responding properly - another 4 years, a new team and a convinced club and support and he might have got there.

I’m saying it didn’t work not that it couldn’t.
 
Unread 14-01-2019, 07:38 PM
S/Side.Red
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by My Name is Keith
City play that style effectively as we all know - I’m not saying it doesn’t work - we all know it can. It didn’t work with our players and our culture. Btw That team were more than capable of slotting villa at home

He imposed a radical change on a team and club incapable of responding properly - another 4 years, a new team and a convinced club and support and he might have got there.

I’m saying it didn’t work not that it couldn’t.
See, far more reasonable posts when you're not trying to get a bite
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