The Glazer Reign Is Crumbling

Originally Posted by Patty_b

Sure thing pal, you telling people you don't give a shit about who owns us, while also telling everyone that you've protested the ownership since 2005 is incredibly consistent and not at all confusing.

Didn’t you say you were in your early 20’s recently? I’ll explain what happened for you so you can’t catch up and get your facts right.

In May 2005 I’d been going to Old Trafford for 20 years. The day the Glazers took over I stopped going because I thought why the £#%&! would I pay someone’s debt who doesn’t give two £#%&!s about United. At this point the only thing that mattered to me while watching United play, at home or in the pub or in the Middle East, was that they’d win the game of football on the pitch. It made no difference to me who owned them.

I’ll never go to old Trafford again but every game I hope they win and I hope they win trophies. Who owns them won’t change that one iota. So at the end of the season when we hopefully win four trophies I’ll celebrate and not once during them celebrations will I think about who owns us.

That’s the difference you see which you can’t comprehend. Because if we win four trophies this season you also won’t give a £#%&! who the owners are. However, if we don’t you really will and then you’ll go to a game on your “free” ticket and tell the owners how much you hate them. Unless we’re winning of course then you’ll probably not say anything.

Originally Posted by believe

Didn’t you say you were in your early 20’s recently?

No.

Originally Posted by believe

I’ll explain what happened for you so you can’t catch up and get your facts right.

Irony.

Originally Posted by believe

In May 2005 I’d been going to Old Trafford for 20 years. The day the Glazers took over I stopped going because I thought why the £#%&! would I pay someone’s debt who doesn’t give two £#%&!s about United. At this point the only thing that mattered to me while watching United play, at home or in the pub or in the Middle East, was that they’d win the game of football on the pitch. It made no difference to me who owned them.

I’ll never go to old Trafford again but every game I hope they win and I hope they win trophies. Who owns them won’t change that one iota. So at the end of the season when we hopefully win four trophies I’ll celebrate and not once during them celebrations will I think about who owns us.

That’s the difference you see which you can’t comprehend. Because if we win four trophies this season you also won’t give a £#%&! who the owners are. However, if we don’t you really will and then you’ll go to a game on your “free” ticket and tell the owners how much you hate them. Unless we’re winning of course then you’ll probably not say anything.

So when the Glazers took over, your relationship with the club fundamentally changed? You continued to support the club, but your feelings towards the club changed to the degree where you took a moral stance and refused to put money towards the debt. Very good. I agree.

So why the £#%&! are you lecturing people who are discussing how they feel their relationship with the club will change depending on who the potential new owners would be? You're allowed to take a moral stance on your relationship with the club following a change in ownership, but anyone else who fears the same happening with a potential future owner is a hypocrite/confused/a wum?.. £#%&! off

And evidently, as with my age (which isn't even a secret ffs), you know £#%&! all about my support for the club. My support is not, and has never been dependent on success. I've think I've said many times that I would happily take relegation down several levels if it meant getting rid of the Glazers and having a more fan involvement with the ownership of the club. In fact I think it would be a right good craic. I know that'll never be an option though, and I know other fans wouldn't agree. And that's OK. I'll always give a £#%&! who the owners are, and if it's state ownership with an unlimited money glitch by known football cheats, then maybe I'll be taking my own moral stance on it which affects my relationship with the club. And you'll probably continue to criticise people for doing so while being belligerently ignorant to your hypocrisy.

I haven’t lectured anyone again you choose to believe what you want about what I post.

What I have done is made several claims to dispel myths that you keep repeating about Qataris and the Middle East based on the fact I’ve lived here for 13 years. Yet you keep making the same comments over and over and over even though I’ve told you they’re not true.

I couldn’t care less about who you want to own us but I will “lecture” you when you constantly make comments about human rights which it seems is you’re only argument for not wanting Qatari owners. Oh and the fact that we’ll be “just like city and psg” when the evidence points to everything but but you’ll adamantly choose to ignore it.

Originally Posted by believe

I haven’t lectured anyone again you choose to believe what you want about what I post.

What I have done is made several claims to dispel myths that you keep repeating about Qataris and the Middle East based on the fact I’ve lived here for 13 years. Yet you keep making the same comments over and over and over even though I’ve told you they’re not true.

You've not made any claims, and they're not myths ffs. All you've done is just ask for evidence and definitions that can be easily obtained with a very simple google search. You telling me claims are not true means absolutely £#%&! all when there is reams of evidence from people who's job it is to uncover these things. You're essentially acting as the Chemical Ali of this thread.

Originally Posted by believe

I couldn’t care less about who you want to own us but I will “lecture” you when you constantly make comments about human rights which it seems is you’re only argument for not wanting Qatari owners. Oh and the fact that we’ll be “just like city and psg” when the evidence points to everything but but you’ll adamantly choose to ignore it.

See above, and they're not the only reasons, I've gone into great depth for the reasons across multiple threads so I'm not going to write them all out again. If you're that bothered, save yourself writing another lecture and look for them, otherwise don't bother trying to guess them.

beef thread on standby.

Originally Posted by est.1878

beef thread on standby.

No beef with patty, it’s an interesting discussion. At least he’s not just following people round with “”

Just out of curiosity let’s say the following:

This season - top 4, 2 trophies.
Summer - 250 million worth of transfers
Next season - league and CL

Under what ownership would that be acceptable?

Mine.

Originally Posted by believe

No beef with patty

In other words no burger.

Originally Posted by believe

Just out of curiosity let’s say the following:

This season - top 4, 2 trophies.
Summer - 250 million worth of transfers
Next season - league and CL

Under what ownership would that be acceptable?

that's acceptable performance by the team under any ownership.

however, that has nothing to do with whether the ownership is acceptable or whether the financial structure behind £250mio of transfers is desirable or sustainable.

Originally Posted by believe

No beef with patty, it’s an interesting discussion. At least he’s not just following people round with “”

Just out of curiosity let’s say the following:

This season - top 4, 2 trophies.
Summer - 250 million worth of transfers
Next season - league and CL

Under what ownership would that be acceptable?

You're conflating on-pitch success with ownership. Primarily most people want a winning football team, the degree to which people can stomach owners they detest varies partly on that success. You and others are of the opinion that ME owners are the best hope for that success, others think that ME ownership isn't the sure thing it's painted as and others still feel that an endless bucket of money would cheapen that success were it to arrive and additionally it would further distort the football industry.

I think that the point being made is 'stuck' on the differences between 'acceptable' and 'desirable'.

The Glazers are not 'desirable' but the majority of us have 'accepted' them, or we wouldn't still be on the Internet talking about United.

I personally find it 'easier' to accept their ownership than I feel I would if we were owned by a Middle Eastern state. Both £#%&!ing horrid though.

Originally Posted by suedeshoes

I think that the point being made is 'stuck' on the differences between 'acceptable' and 'desirable'.

The Glazers are not 'desirable' but the majority of us have 'accepted' them, or we wouldn't still be on the Internet talking about United.

I personally find it 'easier' to accept their ownership than I feel I would if we were owned by a Middle Eastern state. Both £#%&!ing horrid though.

You can’t say that mate, it’s ‘islamophobic’.

" others still feel that an endless bucket of money would cheapen that success were it to arrive"

Here's where I am

When we got the Liverpool game called off it felt like somehow something different would emerge. All the 50 plus one stuff. Of course was just naive unicorn thinking

Triumph in adversdity over easy triumphs for me Clive. Pour that leaky roof all over me

The club suffering a long slow financial death under the Glazers.

Or having the Qatari's make good the hundreds of millions that have been taken out of the club over the years and investing the money needed to return us to where we should be.

I'm happy to hold my nose to keep United from carrying on as perpetual also-rans.

Can I trade mark "knowing ME, knowing man U" for the first cultural exchange fan park thing

Shinawatra put on a food event outside the town hall for city iirc. I'd like to taste some Qatari (national dish is?)

Originally Posted by tatty

The club suffering a long slow financial death under the Glazers.

Or having the Qatari's make good the hundreds of millions that have been taken out of the club over the years and investing the money needed to return us to where we should be.

I'm happy to hold my nose to keep United from carrying on as perpetual also-rans.

Nobody is saying the only option is the Glazers or Qatar though. Well, nobody that isn’t stupid.

Perpetual also-rans ffs. It’s been ten years since our last league title, 6 since our last European trophy, and 15 since our last European Cup. There’s supporters of clubs up and down the country who would kill for that. Unfortunately our success has had the result of making some of our fans incredibly spoilt and entitled.

Regardless, this season alone should be enough to show that to with the right manager in charge, anything is possible. There is no reason we can’t be successful just using the money the club generates itself. Anyone claiming differently is just wrong, there’s no other way to put it.

Hasn’t this season just proven that we can be successful with the glazers in charge? I mean really you could say that us being unsuccessful has had absolutely nothing to do with the glazers.

Originally Posted by Ethers

Nobody is saying the only option is the Glazers or Qatar though. Well, nobody that isn’t stupid.

Always with the passive-aggressive snide

Nobody has said they are the only options, the bidding process has made that clear already.

Originally Posted by Ethers

Perpetual also-rans ffs. It’s been ten years since our last league title, 6 since our last European trophy, and 15 since our last European Cup. There’s supporters of clubs up and down the country who would kill for that. Unfortunately our success has had the result of making some of our fans incredibly spoilt and entitled.

That's history...not interested.

I want the future to be successful.

Originally Posted by Ethers

Regardless, this season alone should be enough to show that to with the right manager in charge, anything is possible. There is no reason we can’t be successful just using the money the club generates itself. Anyone claiming differently is just wrong, there’s no other way to put it.

You seem very sure of your opinions.

You may be right but there would be City, Newcastle and whoever the Qatari's buy (Liverpool?) to compete against...plus Arsenal and Chelsea.

Originally Posted by believe

Hasn’t this season just proven that we can be successful with the glazers in charge? I mean really you could say that us being unsuccessful has had absolutely nothing to do with the glazers.

I have never said the glazers are the reason we haven’t been successful. If you look at what they’ve spent, in my opinion we should have done far better than what we actually have done. The return on investment has been pretty poor, and to me that’s because we’ve had the wrong people in charge, in terms of the manager and those above. Without the glazers taking money out, there probably would have been a bit more to spend. But I think you also have to accept they’ve done a very good of maximising the revenue we make.

Originally Posted by Ethers

I have never said the glazers are the reason we haven’t been successful. If you look at what they’ve spent, in my opinion we should have done far better than what we actually have done. The return on investment has been pretty poor, and to me that’s because we’ve had the wrong people in charge, in terms of the manager and those above. Without the glazers taking money out, there probably would have been a bit more to spend. But I think you also have to accept they’ve done a very good of maximising the revenue we make.

I didn’t say you did I agree with everything you’ve said.