so, what are the pluses and minuses from pre-season?

Originally Posted by borsuk

nani's form has to be the biggest plus for me. valencia has been great, but i expected that, tbh. nani, on the other hand, seems to be really ready to step it up this season, different attitude to him. early days, but fingers crossed.

Nani has been pretty top notch in most pre seasons. Always scores a few crackers, but what ive noticed this pre season is that his runs have become more direct, He could be more effective at timing his runs this season. (Almost Ronaldo esque )

Originally Posted by wiganste

Nani frustrated the £#%&! out of me last night. Chance after chance he had to whip thew ball in the box but he decided to try and beat his man again.

He's improved a lot but he still aint United for my liking.

Edit: It was only a pre-season game and he wasn't shit but not good either. He did do a few decent things.

He always seems to make the wrond decisions for me, the lad has skill, he just needs to think a bit more.

Originally Posted by red @rmy

He always seems to make the wrond decisions for me, the lad has skill, he just needs to think a bit more.

Yep, agree with that. His decision making for a pro at a club like United is very, very poor. It's a big season for him this and he needs to iron the shitaspects out of his game. He is talented, but does he have what it takes to be 'United'? I'm not so sure.

What I have noticed about him, he's put on some muscle. :bi:

Originally Posted by Whalefish

The only game I saw Macheda start in was the Boca match and I thought he was awful. Bad day at the office I suspect. I'm not expecting much from him this season which is why I still think it's a risk having him as 4th choice or one of the striking options.

Think Wellbeck will make far more of an impression given the chance.

Welbeck has missed out being in the u19s championship. This pre-season he would have got a lot of playing time with the first team and it would have been valuable.

Originally Posted by wiganste

Yep, agree with that. His decision making for a pro at a club like United is very, very poor. It's a big season for him this and he needs to iron the shitaspects out of his game. He is talented, but does he have what it takes to be 'United'? I'm not so sure.

What I have noticed about him, he's put on some muscle. :bi:

I said to the missus lastnight in bed, Berbatov looked fit.

Fergie's always talked about Nani's immaturity compared to Ronaldo at the same age and made reference again to it the other week. Seems like he is comfortable with it at the moment but if Fergie still thinks that in a year's time, he'll be off. I'd like to see him succeed - he has all the attributes to be like Figo, albeit not quite that standard - but you wonder if it'll ever fully show through.

We haven't a f'n clue where the goal is. nft

Its all about direction for Nani, He has more skill than most footballers in the top divisions.

If he can be directed and supported he will be a very good player indeed.

A full season od Andersonesque support from the OT faithful and he would be mint IMHO.

But his face doesnt fit i fear ( with most people anyway ) - that Lucas Neill business didnt help.

Originally Posted by SilverSurfer

That Fergie seems to have realised that playing Berbatov deep isn't going to get the best use out of him.

Agreed. I think we'll see a different player, like we have in the friendlies. Yes they were only friendlies but he has still been a different player playing differently. Influencing games more.

Originally Posted by History

Nani has been pretty top notch in most pre seasons. Always scores a few crackers, but what ive noticed this pre season is that his runs have become more direct, He could be more effective at timing his runs this season. (Almost Ronaldo esque )

I think Nani has great potential, but seems to lack the drive and confidence to beat players. Maybe its a lack of pace, but you never really see him run on past players like Ronaldo.

All the players look a yard short pace wise, except the really quick ones. Fergie said the speed work starts on Monday, so it'll be interesting to see the progression come the Charity Shield.

Originally Posted by dunk

Minuses - Too much travelling, really. Carrick seems to being set up as this seasons scapegoat by most, not happy with that. The lack of depth and options in the centre of midfield. The home kit I still hate it.

Pluses - Fabio, Nani, Macheda, Cathcart, Tosic and Gibson have all been impressive enough to suggest they can push on this season. Owen/Berbatov look like a partnership blossoming.

My only critique of the squad is the issues with CM. Scholes is hanging on for dear life and Hargreaves has the farmer stood next to him loading the shotgun. Not enough there in just Anderson, Carrick, Fletcher, Gibson and Giggs, for me. I've thought the midfield was still a bit weak since '07, it's getting weaker.

I can live with the forward line, Macheda and Welbeck need the opportunity to push on, Obertan too, but there is nothing of their calibre coming through in CM, unless Matt James is going to be given a go.

Agree with all of that except the kit bit - I actually like it now tbh. It looks class with black shorts and black socks imo.

Another huge plus for me is Owen's attitude. I think he really seems fired up to prove he is still good enough to play at this level. I said it on here a while back that signing him would be good for people like Kiko and Wellbeck in terms of development and that was rubbished. It is obvious that they will learn things from him.

I am surprised we haven't gone back in for that Kacar lad. I think we need someone who can push on as a runner in midfield and chip in with a few goals. A young Scholes would be an absolute dream but where do you find one of them?

Originally Posted by Part 36 Offer

Agree with all of that except the kit bit - I actually like it now tbh. It looks class with black shorts and black socks imo.

Another huge plus for me is Owen's attitude. I think he really seems fired up to prove he is still good enough to play at this level. I said it on here a while back that signing him would be good for people like Kiko and Wellbeck in terms of development and that was rubbished. It is obvious that they will learn things from him.

I am surprised we haven't gone back in for that Kacar lad. I think we need someone who can push on as a runner in midfield and chip in with a few goals. A young Scholes would be an absolute dream but where do you find one of them?

Agree with all of this.

I think we'll sign a midfielder now United are home etc. Wouldn't be surprised to see us go in for that Kacar. Fergie must be able to see we're desperate for a midfielder?

Originally Posted by Whalefish

The only game I saw Macheda start in was the Boca match and I thought he was awful. Bad day at the office I suspect. I'm not expecting much from him this season which is why I still think it's a risk having him as 4th choice or one of the striking options.

Think Wellbeck will make far more of an impression given the chance.

he won't if he has dislocated his shoulder ( there was a post on redcafe that he had dislocated his shoulders in euro under 19's match. no links though for that! ).

Originally Posted by Part 36 Offer

I am surprised we haven't gone back in for that Kacar lad. I think we need someone who can push on as a runner in midfield and chip in with a few goals. A young Scholes would be an absolute dream but where do you find one of them?

He signed for Juve for £20m.

Not seen enough of the pre-season stuff to make any kind of comment really. I would still maintain that I'd love a goal scoring midfielder in the squad, I think we have plenty of tidy midfielders, not enough that contribute vision & goals. Gourcuff, Diego - both gone this Summer & not for outrageous money really all things considered. Shame.

Originally Posted by Baron_van_Marlon

He signed for Juve for £20m.

Not seen enough of the pre-season stuff to make any kind of comment really. I would still maintain that I'd love a goal scoring midfielder in the squad, I think we have plenty of tidy midfielders, not enough that contribute vision & goals. Gourcuff, Diego - both gone this Summer & not for outrageous money really all things considered. Shame.

milan wouldn't have sold gourcuff to us. in fact they asked him to come back but there was a clause that bordeaux could buy him for £13m and he has happy to stay.

Originally Posted by berba

milan wouldn't have sold gourcuff to us. in fact they asked him to come back but there was a clause that bordeaux could buy him for £13m and he has happy to stay.

if he didn;t want to play for Milan they would have sold him. I know about the clause & why he's at Larry's mob, but we could even have offered them more cash & they'd of been the middle men & pocketed a few mil extra. Obviously it "doesn't work like that" but he's a class player & we'll no doubt be sniffing about for £25m in 12 months time.

Comments about Nani seemed to be varied but the fact he hasn't gone (contrary to endless press speculation) seems to show that the club have faith in him that a lot of fans didn't last seasons. I think Paddy Crerrand almost lip-read Fergie last night "NANI - PASS THE £#%&!ING BALL" - which is stll his fundamental failing and deeply frustrating - like Ronaldo 4/5 years ago.

The complete lack of central midfield last night worried me, but then two of the "brightest prosects" in that department were playing right wing and full back. I can't beleive I missed Anderson scoring, well at least it wasn't open play.

Against Bayern, it was almost as if the players realised the deficiency in the centre, so just passed it wide and tried to go down the wings than battle through the middle. How many times did we see the forwards out wide?

Berbatov still looks like he's come onto the pitch having just found out his wife has been roasted by Rio and Anderson. Does he ever smile?
His touch is still great, his movement and involvement wass better, his control and strength unsurpassed, and was playing more advanced than most of last season. However he's still making passes that no other United player are reading... maybe he needs to spend time on the training ground to say "I'm gonna do this" and it'll work.

Foster has only just come back from (another) injury. Needs games before you can pass judgement.

Scholes seems very static. I can't think he'll start more than half-a-dozen games and sub in 10 more.

Giggs still the best dribbler of the ball the world has ever seen, the fact that most of the players around him are 10-15 years younger makes it all the more remarkable.

Rio is totally composed - looking like Lauren Blanc now.

Johnny Evans has been superb.

If I can summarise - the only things that needs improving are:
(i) a Roy Keane in the centre,
(ii) possibly a goalkeeper,
(iii) possibly a right back like Lahm or Evra.
However, we'll probably sign another forward and winger as usual.

Originally Posted by BulgarianSpectator

If I can summarise - the only things that needs improving are:
(i) a Roy Keane in the centre,
(ii) possibly a goalkeeper,
(iii) possibly a right back like Lahm or Evra.
However, we'll probably sign another forward and winger as usual.

Midfielder, yes, I may have mentioned the same thing
A goalkeeper, no, you have to give Foster and PIG the chance to mature a bit imo.
a RB, no, we have Wes, JOS, Rafael, Fabio and G.Nev. We definitely don't need another, it was just unfortunate that Fletch had to play there last night.

I hope Welbeck hasn't done his shoulder as has been rumoured, but I am over the whole 'we need a striker' thing, really don't see us signing one and we have plenty of youth knocking about that could get a chance and improve if we do get a few injuries in there. I have an odd feeling Obertan will end up a central striker, not sure why.

As for wingers, no more for the time being, please. We struggle enough through the center as it is with every £#%&!er pulling wide.

Nani has to deliver this season. Next summer he will have two years left on his contract. He has performed quite well, but it is difficult to read too much into how a player like him performs in friendlies, as there is no pressure.

Owen has looked quite sharp, and has managed to avoid injury. I suspect when he is fully fit, the chance he had yesterday would have been converted. His touch just let him down and he looked £#%&!ed when he came off.

Anderson was crap in Asia, and then went on to score his first goal in Germany. I can't say his performances were a plus, as he has underperformed again. The goal obviously was though.

I was impressed by Cathcart against Boca. No real surprise though, as the lad has a lot of ability. Path to the first team somewhat blocked though. I expect him to go out on loan again this season, hopefully at a decent level (lower Premiership team perhaps).

Foster, didn't look good whatsoever. It amazes me how freely people will slag PIG off and yet Foster gets given an almost free pass.

Berbatov has been impressive. Still needs to up the goal count though and shoot more often when the opportunity arises.

Valencia, was impressed by him in his brief cameos. I think he'll have that right hand side nailed down as his own relatively easily.


Evans, impressive again yesterday against a decent outfit. Could be a permanent member of the squad (first XI soon) for over 10 years. Sometimes it is easy to forget how young he is, he deals with pressure extremely well and rarely gets flustered. Still has a few things to iron out, but they will come with experience. He has all the tools to become one of the best in Europe imo.

Tosic, was impressed with some of his deliveries in Asia. Not really pressured much out there though. I'd like to see how he plays against Valencia next week.

Giggs, looks quite sharp. Scored a hat-trick (is that his first ever?) and looked quite sharp yesterday...at least going off his mad sprinting in the latter stages! Unlucky not to get an assist too off a great ball in for Rooney.

Scholes, not been impressed at all. I've never seen him give the ball away so freely. Would expect a very limited role for him this season.

Disappointed we didn't see Obertan. Will be playing catch up in terms of fitness, and that is a shit way to start at a new club.