Worried about the debt at United ? What are YOU going to do about it?

Originally Posted by El Chalten

we live in a corporate world.

once utd floated on the stock market the club was corporate. the fan was then seen as a customer and not a supporter.

i don't really care who buys the club as long as they are wealthy enough to be able to run it.

the glazers weren't/aren't big enough to own a club like utd. (that's the problem)

i'm pissed off because they are raping the club and taking the club down the swanny.

atm, selling the training ground looks like a definate.

what's next? OT itself?

utd fans need to come together, the fanzines need need to talk to each other and sort something out.

scarf's, shirts, is all well and good, but why not a mass £#%&!in pitch invasion during a key game. (milan at home)

what's the worse that can happen?

nft.

a mass pitch invasion would just get booed by the other 74,000 people

it's not a corporate world, it's a natural world.

the glazers are apparently worth over 2bn and have their own foundation etc, which means they are "big enough" whatever that means to own United

the problem is they are part of a network of £#%&!ing spivs that's been allowed to get their horrible greedy mitts on united's plums by bankrolling these people to front their scam

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

a mass pitch invasion would just get booed by the other 74,000 people

it's not a corporate world, it's a natural world.

the glazers are apparently worth over 2bn and have their own foundation etc, which means they are "big enough" whatever that means to own United

the problem is they are part of a network of £#%&!ing spivs that's been allowed to get their horrible greedy mitts on united's plums by bankrolling these people to front their scam

doesn't mean they have £2bn in the bank though, does it. be surprised if they had a quarter of that.

nft.

Originally Posted by El Chalten

doesn't mean they have £2bn in the bank though, does it. be surprised if they had a quarter of that.

nft.

neither does warren buffet. in fact if nasdaq falls by 90%, warren buffet won't be in top 100 rich list.

most billionares only have virtual wealth

Originally Posted by rafabio

neither does warren buffet. in fact if nasdaq falls by 90%, warren buffet won't be in top 100 rich list.

most billionares only have virtual wealth

that's my point.

nft.

Originally Posted by El Chalten

doesn't mean they have £2bn in the bank though, does it. be surprised if they had a quarter of that.

nft.

don't know. does anybody know where they stash their loot yet?

saw a list that had them at 300th or something like that on the world wealth league, making them pretty near perfect candidates for the capitalist industry to use as a front to milk the world's richest sporting franchise. imo imagination.

describing what the glazers have done as an investment is an exercise in sophistry imo, the equivalent to describing as investment the actions of somebody gambling down the casino with another man's chips, while simultaneously billing him for the pleasure.

the glazers are gambling with other people's money. the stake they put in, and the loans secured against their assets, represent the entry price, but they will not take a hit. they will issue bonds against the club, sell off and lease back carrington, sell and lease back ot etc. etc. before they take a hit. that's no investment as far as i'm concerned.

what ever happened to greek tycoons? when i was a lad all the tycoons seemed to be greek.

Originally Posted by borsuk

describing what the glazers have done as an investment is an exercise in sophistry imo, the equivalent to describing as investment the actions of somebody gambling down the casino with another man's chips, while simultaneously billing him for the pleasure.

the glazers are gambling with other people's money. the stake they put in, and the loans secured against their assets, represent the entry price, but they will not take a hit. they will issue bonds against the club, sell off and lease back carrington, sell and lease back ot etc. etc. before they take a hit. that's no investment as far as i'm concerned.

they've invested £#%&! all. except a bit of time. mainly to negotiate with their backers i'd imagine.

Originally Posted by rafabio

because unlike any other business customers don't put their money in and expect more money on that back. Here the investment is one sided where the money goes in and never comes back.

You're not making a lot of sense here.

What money do United fans invest in the club.

Originally Posted by LaPaz

You're not making a lot of sense here.

What money do United fans invest in the club.

apart from their heart, mind and soul...£#%&!ing shit loads in tickets, merchandise etc etc

rafabio, you obviously know £#%&! all about this and you're just embarrassing yourself with idiotic comments. stick to football, eh.

oh, wait...

Originally Posted by LaPaz

You're not making a lot of sense here.

What money do United fans invest in the club.

the money that fans pay to watch the team at OT, the money that the fans pay to watch united on TV and finally the merchandising that the fans buy.

Glazer's have an investment at united but without their money as of now. But what happens if somehow the value of united and OT will reduce to 1/10th of its current value? Then glazer's have to pay the rest out of their pockets.

Although its not comparable its similar to way you take loans for a house. Now you put it on rent and with the rent money you will pay the monthly instalments of the loan. So after 20 years when the complete loan is repaid you have a house for which you actually never paid. (for pedantic's : its not as straight forward as that but it is similar ).

In fact, a lot of businesses are structured in that way. As much as irritable it is to call united a business, it became one at the moment it was floated on the market. In fact that is the biggest mistake that happened in english football.

If you had the system like in spain, even though you could have the fickleness of fans at board level, at least you were rest assured the primary motive of the people at the club would be for success of the club on the pitch and not off it.

Originally Posted by borsuk

rafabio, you obviously know £#%&! all about this and you're just embarrassing yourself with idiotic comments. stick to football, eh.

oh, wait...

you are always easily irritated. why so?

Originally Posted by BarryX

apart from their heart, mind and soul...£#%&!ing shit loads in tickets, merchandise etc etc

When you buy a ticket it entitlers you to a seat at the gamr nothing more nothing less.

All this heart mind soul is in the fans head & every club trades on it to exploit their supporters.

Sorry to be so blunt but the stark reality is that United are no different to any other corporate entity and as such is only interested in making money.
The football is a means to make that money & to the club the supporters are no less customers than shoppers are at Tesco.

Originally Posted by rafabio

the money that fans pay to watch the team at OT, the money that the fans pay to watch united on TV and finally the merchandising that the fans buy.

Glazer's have an investment at united but without their money as of now. But what happens if somehow the value of united and OT will reduce to 1/10th of its current value? Then glazer's have to pay the rest out of their pockets.

Although its not comparable its similar to way you take loans for a house. Now you put it on rent and with the rent money you will pay the monthly instalments of the loan. So after 20 years when the complete loan is repaid you have a house for which you actually never paid. (for pedantic's : its not as straight forward as that but it is similar ).

In fact, a lot of businesses are structured in that way. As much as irritable it is to call united a business, it became one at the moment it was floated on the market. In fact that is the biggest mistake that happened in english football.

If you had the system like in spain, even though you could have the fickleness of fans at board level, at least you were rest assured the primary motive of the people at the club would be for success of the club on the pitch and not off it.

All the fans are doing is buying a product (see my post above) it's not an investment it's a purchase.

Originally Posted by rafabio

you are always easily irritated. why so?

i have a low tolerance for idiocy. it's quite beyond my control.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/8453905.stm

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/8453905.stm

Shocking stuff eh

Originally Posted by John Blazini

Shocking stuff eh

Football will eat itself.

Originally Posted by Sparky***

Football will eat itself.

They said that about pop.