*Official* Sunderland v United Match Thread - Teams and Value

Originally Posted by MJ Ramone

True.
Leaving Berbatov & Evra out yesterday was absolutely mental.

see now i'm not sure about that. Evra has been little better than Rooney this season so far. undecided whether he was rested or dropped with a flea in his ear yesterday tbh. i imagine he's had a few serious %@#$&!ings lately. really needs to get his head down and concentrate on football again.

said before that there was some logic in resting Berbatov given the shift he put in in Spain - until you saw his immediate effect on our performance when he did come on. i mean we weren't great 2nd half by any stretch, but it was a marked improvement on the 1st. i'd have liked to see Ferguson start both him and Hernandez, but to start neither of them seems ridiculous.

macheda and pea looked very good when they came on against valencia, while owen scored when he came on against bolton. i can see the idea in starting two of them and had it come off it would have looked like a stroke of genius. i can't for the life of me see the sense in playing macheda wide left, however. if he's to be used he needs to be used as a traditional no 9 where he can put himself about and unsettle the defence, not out on the wing trying to pretend he's going to jink past the full back.

with berbatov, pea, macheda and, soon, rooney i don't see too much to worry about up front. much more of an issue is the midfield, which has yet to click for us this year and which is struggling to support the front players effectively. it's not clear who is supposed to perform this role for us.

scholes and carrick both sit deep and look to dictate the play; they are a great pair for possession and building attacks, but neither will run past the attackers. fletcher can do it but he is clearly better at breaking up opponents' play, attacking the box is not his natural game. which, unless we consider giggs for a central role (not a bad option, with pea or rooney left of a three ahead) means that anderson would be the obvious choice, but he is still a way off full fitness. it was noticeable that in his two appearances since coming back from injury he has played further up the field than he has previously - almost as a support striker against valencia, albeit with a park-esque disruptive role. i think it represents simultaneously a big challenge for anderson and a big opportunity; he has an important role to play this season and a chance to carve out a central role for himself if he can step up to the mark.

Rooney can play the role Scholes played 10 years ago, alongside a more defensive midfielder. That leaves the Bulgarian and Chicarito to play up front. And that leaves Owen free to return to Liverpool and play in the Championship next season.

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

see now i'm not sure about that. Evra has been little better than Rooney this season so far. undecided whether he was rested or dropped with a flea in his ear yesterday tbh. i imagine he's had a few serious %@#$&!ings lately. really needs to get his head down and concentrate on football again.

.

But what's baffling is that all the above made sense until the Bolton match, when he had a really good game and looked to be at least approaching his normal standard again. So to leave him out just after that....

the only explanation for the evra decision is some minor knock in training or a bit of a bug. can't believe fergie just decided to rest him prior to an international break.

Originally Posted by BulgarianSpectator

Rooney can play the role Scholes played 10 years ago, alongside a more defensive midfielder. That leaves the Bulgarian and Chicarito to play up front. And that leaves Owen free to return to Liverpool and play in the Championship next season.

Rooney in the centre of midfield? Seriously?

Would be a total waste of him, when at his best he can really bully defenders with his physical power and pace and the aggression he brings to the game. Put him in central midfield and his inconsistent touch and passing would be highlighted.

As for Evra, left Utd with a total lack of penetration and width on that side, which was always going to happen with that selection.

We should turn him into a defensive midfielder. He's the new Roy Keane.

Originally Posted by Tiberian

Rooney in the centre of midfield? Seriously?

Would be a total waste of him, when at his best he can really bully defenders with his physical power and pace and the aggression he brings to the game. Put him in central midfield and his inconsistent touch and passing would be highlighted.

As for Evra, left Utd with a total lack of penetration and width on that side, which was always going to happen with that selection.

i agree, it would be a waste of his talents. and in a two with two strikers ahead of him his lack of positional discipline would make him a liability defensively.

the explanation for Evra's omission that makes sense to me is that his level has dropped dramatically even from where he had slipped to at the back end of last season. as such, Ferguson has given him a wake-up call. an injury may well be cited further down the line.

That explains Evra, but doesn't explain why O'Pie instead of Fabio.

Sunderland's right midfielder yesterday was about 6ft2.

Against Arsenal, Sunderland's main tactic was long diagonal balls to the right, and he invariably won every header against Clichy.

Might explain why Fergie went for O'Shea.

I'm more troubled by the Macheda/Owen calamity. Yesterday confirmed to me - and hopefully to Fergie - that Owen is not a footballer. He never has been, but he used to be a good goalscorer. He is, at best, an impact sub to bring on for the last 10 minutes in games when we're dominating possession and need a goal.

He is NOT a starter, and should never start a proper game for us ever again.

Originally Posted by Terry Silver

Sunderland's right midfielder yesterday was about 6ft2.

Against Arsenal, Sunderland's main tactic was long diagonal balls to the right, and he invariably won every header against Clichy.

wasting your breath mate tbh. correct, of course, but wasting your breath all the same. bang on about owen, though that should have been obvious to anybody paying attention to his wage thief activities at newcastle.

Owen is not my idea of a footballer for sure, but the fact remains that last season he was able to join in with some of United's best counter-attacking movements. It's just a fact. Obviously, imo, he shouldn't have been paired with Macheda yesterday.

As for Evra, if he was playing well and on his game then regardless of Sunderland's potential threat based on what they did in a previous game against an Arsene Wenger team he would've started the game, and therein lies the tale.

the games up away from home we've been sussed out fergie dosen't have the players with the ability to change it either.
we seem to be hanging around waiting for an out of form rooney to carry us on his shoulders again.

Originally Posted by Horst_ Bucholst

the games up away from home we've been sussed out fergie dosen't have the players with the ability to change it either.we seem to be hanging around waiting for an out of form rooney to carry us on his shoulders again.

He does, but they are either out of form or injured.

Meanwhile, garbage like O'Shea and Owen are available to play every £#%&!ing game

United clearly have got the players to change games and to win them

yesterday was only the 2nd time this season that the side haven't scored and been in the lead at some point during the 2nd half. the other was the 0-0 with Rangers when Rooney and Hernandez started up front and Valencia got injured btw.