Obertan

Originally Posted by Mr_Ed

I've not read all this thread but Ronnie took 2/3 years to reach anything near his full potential...

Valencia worries me a bit because he's already in his twenties but we can't judge Obertan on a couple of performances given he's been out for 3 months...!

Why, for me he's really starting to look the part?

Originally Posted by borsuk

i think valencia has been doing well for us. improving all the time and gives us good balance on the right. nice defensive side to his play as well. needs more confidence and needs a more athletic and attacking full back behind him imo.

quite happy with valencia tbh.

Me too. Thought he played well yesterday

Originally Posted by borsuk

i think valencia has been doing well for us. improving all the time and gives us good balance on the right. nice defensive side to his play as well. needs more confidence and needs a more athletic and attacking full back behind him imo.

quite happy with valencia tbh.

I'd love to see Fergie pick a twin there.

Originally Posted by borsuk

i think valencia has been doing well for us. improving all the time and gives us good balance on the right. nice defensive side to his play as well. needs more confidence and needs a more athletic and attacking full back behind him imo.

quite happy with valencia tbh.

He's done ok BUT... he bombs down to the edge of the 18 yard line and then either crosses (well duh) or stops and brings the ball back.

I think we've got so used to Ronnie attacking defenders time and again and he was fantastic at doing so and Valencia is different in that respect. I just wish he'd drive at the full backs a lot more and attack the area too - suppose he just needs some time.

Originally Posted by antonin jablonsky

Why, for me he's really starting to look the part?

He really needs to purchase a left foot though.

Originally Posted by Mr_Ed

He's done ok BUT... he bombs down to the edge of the 18 yard line and then either crosses (well duh) or stops and brings the ball back.

I think we've got so used to Ronnie attacking defenders time and again and he was fantastic at doing so and Valencia is different in that respect. I just wish he'd drive at the full backs a lot more and attack the area too - suppose he just needs some time.

It's very early in his United career but i think he's really started to do that recently as evidenced by his two goals and nearly a third at Anfield. We have to realise that he's a winger though, not whatever Ronaldo was.

Originally Posted by Mr_Ed

He's done ok BUT... he bombs down to the edge of the 18 yard line and then either crosses (well duh) or stops and brings the ball back.

I think we've got so used to Ronnie attacking defenders time and again and he was fantastic at doing so and Valencia is different in that respect. I just wish he'd drive at the full backs a lot more and attack the area too - suppose he just needs some time.

as anton says, let's see him with rafael

i could understand playing o'shea behind ronaldo, but i think valencia has a lot more defensively and we can get a better balance with an attacking full back.

injuries have hit us quite hard this year, though it's not headline players for the most part so the papers ignore it. still, considering that we've lost vds and rafael, had rio, vidic and evans all carrying injuries and have lost fletcher for a few games as well it's no surprise our defence has been a bit shaky.

i think we'd see a more attacking rb helping valencia if we had (a) two fit centre halves and (b) fletcher or hargreaves to stiffen the midfield. we've been less committed going forward because we've been a bit shaky at the back. great to see wes back yesterday

i'd love to see this team put out a few times:

vds
rafael - rio - evans - evra
valencia - fletcher - anderson - giggs
rooney
berbatov

Originally Posted by wiganste

A prime example of his lack of quality stuck out like a sore thumb last night. The pass to Rooney for Berbatovs disallowed goal.

The ball should have been played one or two seconds earlier but he couldn't see that.

Watch the move again. It's Rooney's fault for not staying onside. If Nani plays that ball earlier, he has to play it to the defender's right, meaning Rooney would have had to beat him himself. Because he delays until the defender moves over to cover Rooney, he can play it behind him, completely taking the lad out of the picture and leaving Rooney completely free in the box.

Very easy to blame Nani as usual, like the commentator did, but not really fair in this instance.

Originally Posted by Mr_Ed

I've not read all this thread but Ronnie took 2/3 years to reach anything near his full potential...

Valencia worries me a bit because he's already in his twenties but we can't judge Obertan on a couple of performances given he's been out for 3 months...!

Valencia was man of the match for me yesterday! not just for his attacking play but the hard work he put in for the team. he looks better every time i see him.

love seeing these young players getting a game thought obertan did ok probably should have scored
i'd rather start him than nani whose pain threshold seems to have deteriorated from last season.

apart from that chance he should've buried, i thought he looked lively and did ok seeing as though it was his first league game for us.

some £#%&!ing head on the @#%&!, though.

Good nickname though...Kryton?

Originally Posted by bcred

Good nickname though...Kryton?

Originally Posted by bcred

Good nickname though...Kryton?

I prefer 'Heid'.

He reminds of a condor for some reason.

did i fall asleep and miss 3 months of the season? thought he only played for about 20 minutes - what kind of #@&%!-knocker judges a player after that amount of time?

Originally Posted by Gypsum Fantastic

did i fall asleep and miss 3 months of the season? thought he only played for about 20 minutes - what kind of #@&%!-knocker judges a player after that amount of time?

A drunken one.

Originally Posted by wiganste

Since when will that stop people on here writing himn off?

We ought to sell him in January to save the bother.

Nani's technique actually isn't that bad, his problem is that he is clearly one of the thickest footballers I've ever witnessed. Maybe it's my imagination, but he seems to have learned absolutely nothing in all this time at the club, and it makes me smile when his defenders on here talk about his 'potential' as though he is 18 and arrived in the summer.

As far as Valencia goes, I have a real fear that his lack of a left foot is going to severely limit his options and make him meat and drink for top quality Premiership defenders, none of whom, incidently, play for Blackburn. Berbatov got a lot of stick for being on his case against the dippers, but I felt he was right, AV make very few smart runs and aside from his one cross for Rooney and being on the end of the move where he hit the bar, rendered our right side extremely predictable. there was one moment yesterday where he got the ball on the edge of the area and his whole body language screamed ' what do I do now?' If I were Fergie I'd fine him for every time he used his right foot in training

Difference between me and many who post here though is that I very much want to be proven wrong and will readily admit if I am..


Edit: In mitigation, his situation is hardly helped by the fact that O'Shea's idea of an overlapping run is 20 yards behind and hugging the touchline. Rather than accepting that our utility squad player is now our full-time right back, we should be searching high and low for a right sided Evra.

Originally Posted by borsuk

as anton says, let's see him with rafael

i could understand playing o'shea behind ronaldo, but i think valencia has a lot more defensively and we can get a better balance with an attacking full back.

injuries have hit us quite hard this year, though it's not headline players for the most part so the papers ignore it. still, considering that we've lost vds and rafael, had rio, vidic and evans all carrying injuries and have lost fletcher for a few games as well it's no surprise our defence has been a bit shaky.

i think we'd see a more attacking rb helping valencia if we had (a) two fit centre halves and (b) fletcher or hargreaves to stiffen the midfield. we've been less committed going forward because we've been a bit shaky at the back. great to see wes back yesterday

i'd love to see this team put out a few times:

vds
rafael - rio - evans - evra
valencia - fletcher - anderson - giggs
rooney
berbatov

I'd largely agree but possibly would prefer:

vds
rafael - vidic - evans -evra
valencia - fletcher - hargreaves - anderson/giggs
rooney berbatov/welbeck

The two attacking full backs would provide width and that midfield would be very difficult to play against leaving the two front players to have complete freedom to attack.

One of the few points of Waddle's I agreed with y'day is that this Utd team is maybe a little too easy to play against at the moment.

With the exception of the two front players, all the team above is reasonably quick and well able to tackle. If we'd more control of the middle of the park, you'd suddenly start seeing the defence and forward line looking better.

The pace is particularly critical. I remember one ball Anderson lost y'day but the kid had the speed to make up for the mistake. That's something many of our older players haven't got any more - even if their experience means they don't tend to lose the ball as often, Scholes being the key example.