The midfield & impending lack of creativity

Originally Posted by Baron_van_Marlon

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Some of the best players in the world are small in stature.

I could see Cole doing well due to an under estimation of his talents in this country compared with a jonny foriegner (just like the ones I championed!).

They're a family of midgets.

Originally Posted by Throw

They're a family of midgets.

tell them to stay away from Mexican brasses then

Originally Posted by Throw

They're a family of midgets.

you specifically said dad and dwarf before

am i to understand that this was a fabrication for comic effect?

Originally Posted by Baron_van_Marlon

There were plenty of rumours last summer about the Scouse sniffing around him, he'd not jump out of the frying pan as it were to that shower but if Fergie comes knocking I can see it being a different story.

There is absolutely zero chance of it happening.

He may well jump at the chance. They won't sell him to us though.

Players at Chelsea are off limits unless they're on a bosman. It staggers me that people can't grasp this!

Originally Posted by Coracao

There is absolutely zero chance of it happening.

He may well jump at the chance. They won't sell him to us though.

Players at Chelsea are off limits unless they're on a bosman. It staggers me that people can't grasp this!

I'm just £#%&!ing bored mate, don't piss on my bonfire.

Originally Posted by Coracao

There is absolutely zero chance of it happening.

He may well jump at the chance. They won't sell him to us though.

Players at Chelsea are off limits unless they're on a bosman. It staggers me that people can't grasp this!

now look here

1. i've discovered i've been duped over coles parentage and you come along with a sensible post in the middle of my argumemnt with a former friend

2. who is that new lovely in your avatar and can you put the name next to them in future?

3. you're a fine chap. hoorah

Originally Posted by Billy Baroo

you specifically said dad and dwarf before

am i to understand that this was a fabrication for comic effect?

Nothings changed. His Dad is still a dwarf.

I was just quoting Quadrophenia for comic effect.

Originally Posted by Billy Baroo

now look here

1. i've discovered i've been duped over coles parentage and you come along with a sensible post in the middle of my argumemnt with a former friend

2. who is that new lovely in your avatar and can you put the name next to them in future?

3. you're a fine chap. hoorah

Mr Baroo,

I shall address point 2 only.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hgQknoPF-10

The videos clips later on in that video. Peaktastic.

She's 70 odd now though.

Expect one from the following:

Downing
Barton
Arteta

Originally Posted by Coracao

Mr Baroo,

I shall address point 2 only.

YouTube - Claudia Cardinale

The videos clips later on in that video. Peaktastic.

She's 70 odd now though.

i love claudia, daft of me not to recognise her

i actually assumed it was a modern day model as that is you modus operandi

Originally Posted by Part 36 Offer

Good accurate posting from S/side tbh

I remember someone else mentioning that Valencia had played predominantly centrally for Ecuador and that he certainly has the capacity to play there.

I think it may have been Sloane. Marlo attempted to laugh him off the forum.

It was me, and it wasn't just Marlo acting the @#%&!.

Originally Posted by Sandman

It was me, and it wasn't just Marlo acting the @#%&!.

i did also say it and marlo did try to laugh me off but my superior knowledge will shine through

Originally Posted by Baron_van_Marlon

If anyone's desperate or dedicated enough to take notice of all the posts on here a few of us have been banging on about the midfield's lack of goal scoring & creativity for a little while. Names like Diego, Gourcuff & Ribery were touted long before this summer & the departure of the only genuinely creative threat we possesed outside of the strikers & an aging, brilliantly reinvented Ryan Giggs leaves me shitting it a bit at the moment.

So where does that leave us this summer? Scholes was on the wane before this past season. A legend in every sense of the word, and although probably capable of sticking around this season it's impossible, unfair & frankly unlikely we should expect him to produce week in, week out. He's done us proud, and he'll still pull the strings & ping some majestic passes around but realistically I'm thinking we'll see him maybe 15 time in the league including subs appearances & maybe another 5 in all other competitions. His goal scoring threat is minimal, & it's time for someone else to take the mantle.

Giggsy proved the priceless nature of a player who can collect the ball in the centre of the park & move it positively. Be it a 10 yard carry & lay off or an incisive first time hit to a colleague - he was choosing his options so well (up until the CL final...) & in the most fitting of tributes was rewarded with the PFA award. His influence & experience in deciding how to play the game can't be over emphasised, his courage to continue to play positively is a lesson in itself. Ronaldo used to get up & dribble, or shoot, again & again no matter how many times he was kicked or hit row Z. Ferge praised that & we may have got frustrated, but it was a commendable attribute, he never hid. Giggs doesn't hide when it comes to playing in a more refined way, but one that is equally as positive. & as well as Fletcher, Carrick & Anderson can play, I'm not convinced any of them have what it takes to influence the centre of the park the way Scholes & Giggs have. But with the squad, we can find places for all of them, without fail, they've done superbly in their own ways.

So how, or who would we turn to? We've got more wingers than you can shake a stick at. They're all now relatively inexperienced & Park aside, genuine wide men. So the middle of the pitch isn't going to get troubled by a clever turn, a drop of a shoulder & a movement that opens a side up by any of them.

I was gagging for Diego or Gourcuff. A shiney Jonny Foriegner with a flash name that can do something unexpected but also has reached a stage in their career where a move to a big side would see them reach a new level. It remains to be seen if they do kick on & become the players I'm expecting, but the fact is they're not coming here so who is the alternative?

Tradtionally, United would throw some cash at a domestic rival & poach the best of the rest as it were. Yorke, Cole, Carrick, Berbatov, Ferdinand etc. Players who have shown a willingness to want to express themselves & capable of fitting the system United have. Passing, moving, the team is greater than the sum of it's parts etc. So if we've exhausted the opportunities for an overseas player to come in, who would you view as a domestic option?

I think we can ignore anyone other than say maybe Modric from Spurs. We've already had their best player anyway. & Modric himself has struggled to get to grips with the physicality of this league. A fine player at International level mind. Arsenal? Fabregas or no one. & he'd cost £40m. Ouch. He also wants to £#%&! off to Barcelona, we might make the money back to replace him? No more £#%&!ing Scousers. End of. Everton have Arteta? Cheapish, good player, playing in a workman like side which he provides the class. Good on free kicks. Good age. Nice hair. No one from City, & Villa central midfield / creative department is basically Ashley Young. & we have enough young wingers already as discussed. The rest of the league... erm.... erm.................... frankly the Premier League, outside of the top 4, and the nouvaeu riche, is dogshit.

Which leads me to my drawn out answer... a man with a head so large it has been thought someone pressed his buttons in a special way & activated a 'comedy' cheat. No matter how large his swede is, he is a cracking player. & a genuine goal threat. & someone Fergie has admired for over a decade. & someone who might... just might, be surplus to requirements at his current club with a new manager, a new attacking wide player (Zhirkov) & a man who finished the season in fine form for them (Malouda) probably ahead of him as he returns from injury. Step forward Mr Joseph John Cole. He should be playing in the centre of the park. His last 3 full seasons at Chelsea have seen him score 9, 11 & 10 from midfield & a fair chunk of that is through the negative Mourinho period & upheaval around him. Never played in his 'correct' position, he's maturing - 27 at the moment, not 28 until late November. We know he can beat a man, he tackles - remember his season at West Ham when he was playing his %@#$&!s off in the middle of the pitch?

Here's a summary for anyone who can't be arsed with all that...: I think we should buy Joe Cole because no one else is available & he's actually a very good player.

we have hargy to score goals and carrick to pass like an angel. all is well at camp trafford.

Sneijder should probably have been brought in at the same time as Carrick, but of course by the following summer the swoop for Anderson and Nani was on and we'd also had to wait a year for Hargreaves.

the incredible creativity we've lost with Ronaldo leaves a hole that no central midfielder is likely to be able to fill.

even though Carrick has been goal shy since day 1 at United (despite showing what a superb finisher he can be now and again) and I have drawn the wrath of Carrick on here for mentioning it, there is also a bit of a myth around this lack of goals from our central midfield.

we have rarely if ever had better overall goal returns than we've had over the past 3 seasons. so even though the central mids (Harg, Scholes, Carrick, Fletcher, Gibson, Anderson) have only managed 31 goals between them in the league and CL in that time the team's goal output has remained pretty constant. the reason for that is obviously Ronaldo and his phenomenal creativity - everyone was happy to give him the ball.

basically the figures are misleadingly bad imo for the central midfield largely because we were geared towards exploiting the goal potential from elsewhere in the side. now that Ronaldo has gone the team dynamic will alter and the goals will be more spread out.


fwiw the point about our wide men seems a bit off to me. Valencia and Nani in particular are happy to be played in down the centre drifting in off the flanks. and we have plenty of evidence that Nani can be lethal from out to in with that shot of his. and when he gets it right it goes in quite often as well. agree about that horrible @#%&! Cole though, could do worse.

if we all direct our chi towards wilmslow and fergie's house, i reckon we can get this done lads



altogether now...

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

Sneijder should probably have been brought in at the same time as Carrick, but of course by the following summer the swoop for Anderson and Nani was on and we'd also had to wait a year for Hargreaves.

the incredible creativity we've lost with Ronaldo leaves a hole that no central midfielder is likely to be able to fill.

even though Carrick has been goal shy since day 1 at United (despite showing what a superb finisher he can be now and again) and I have drawn the wrath of Carrick on here for mentioning it, there is also a bit of a myth around this lack of goals from our central midfield.

we have rarely if ever had better overall goal returns than we've had over the past 3 seasons. so even though the central mids (Harg, Scholes, Carrick, Fletcher, Gibson, Anderson) have only managed 31 goals between them in the league and CL in that time the team's goal output has remained pretty constant. the reason for that is obviously Ronaldo and his phenomenal creativity - everyone was happy to give him the ball.

basically the figures are misleadingly bad imo for the central midfield largely because we were geared towards exploiting the goal potential from elsewhere in the side. now that Ronaldo has gone the team dynamic will alter and the goals will be more spread out.


fwiw the point about our wide men seems a bit off to me. Valencia and Nani in particular are happy to be played in down the centre drifting in off the flanks. and we have plenty of evidence that Nani can be lethal from out to in with that shot of his. and when he gets it right it goes in quite often as well. agree about that horrible @#%&! Cole though, could do worse.

ronaldo was, at least in his last two seasons, much more the cutting edge of our team than the creative hub. i think what we've lost is less creativity than firepower, for want of a better word.

Originally Posted by borsuk

ronaldo was, at least in his last two seasons, much more the cutting edge of our team than the creative hub. i think what we've lost is less creativity than firepower, for want of a better word.

don't think I've seen a more creative player in my life tbh

certainly not in the shirt anyhoo

maybe didn't have the vision of a Cantona or a Scholes but...

Either of those signed aswell as this fella;



We would be strong as £#%&! in the middle again, can see Scholesy leaving and looking at Hargreaves I have very little faith atm..

Originally Posted by Tumescent Throb

don't think I've seen a more creative player in my life tbh

certainly not in the shirt anyhoo

maybe didn't have the vision of a Cantona or a Scholes but...

all depends on your definition of creativity, i suppose.

last season our most creative players were
giggs
berbatov
rooney
carrick

as i said, for me ronaldo has become much more effective as a weapon but less creative for the team in the last two seasons. that's in no way a criticism of the lad, btw, but a result of the way fergie chose to use him. with a couple of out and out strikers at real i'd imagine he will play a bit deeper there and be less of a goalscorer and more of a creative influence next year.

Originally Posted by Aloe Blacc

Either of those signed aswell as this fella;



We would be strong as £#%&! in the middle again, can see Scholesy leaving and looking at Hargreaves I have very little faith atm..

You're just plucking names that may be available. Modric has struggled to assert himself in the PL and is a bit too lightweight, has been moved out wide left to get the center of midfield working from what I've seen.

Moutinho is £#%&!ing tiny, whenever he has played against us he has struggled to get into the game, he struggled to impose himself at the U21 tournament a few years ago as well. Just a bit too small and light for us.

De Rossi, seems a good player, looked good and bad fairly evenly in the games I've seen, but the fact of the matter is he won't be leaving Roma. Ever.

Anything else out there. We don't want to be signing players just for the sake of it.