would pele be the greatest player in the world

i hope the dubious goals panel are going to have aa look at that first one

Originally Posted by Baron_van_Marlon

Do you mean Di Stéfano or are you actually a bit "special" ?



Didn't mean he was slow, but compared to the supposed 'athletes' of today (players who can hit the 100m in roughly 11 & a smidge seconds) his physical attributes wouldn't have neccessarily had such a large impact on his career. Someone like Henry, who has depended on his pace to help him be such a top player for example along with his vision etc would still be made to look almost ordinary compared to Pele if he was around in the modern game.

jordie's dad doesn't get a mention either,or matthews

motwtw

no. fabregas. next.

Merson in his prime > Pele in his prime.
























(probably)

Of course he would, by some margin too. Pele was absolutely phenomenal. Close to 100% two footed, strong, prodigious vertical leap, speed and stamina, hammer of a shot, superb touch, excellent dribbling skills, brilliant off-the-ball movement, a natural predatory instinct and fantastic vision and creativity.

He also had the audacity to try things that no-one else would even think of. To give you an idea what I'm talking about, he could deliberately play the ball off the ankle or shin of an opponent and know exactly where the ball would end up. All while running at full stride!

Originally Posted by Serenity Now

Of course he would, by some margin too. Pele was absolutely phenomenal. Close to 100% two footed, strong, prodigious vertical leap, speed and stamina, hammer of a shot, superb touch, excellent dribbling skills, brilliant off-the-ball movement, a natural predatory instinct and fantastic vision and creativity.

He also had the audacity to try things that no-one else would even think of. To give you an idea what I'm talking about, he could deliberately play the ball off the ankle or shin of an opponent and know exactly where the ball would end up. All while running at full stride!

I'm sure it was Zagallo who asked by a reporter after he'd subbed the Keeper.. something along the lines of..

"Do you not know who your best Goalkeeper is ? "

he replied.

" I do, but he already plays at Number 10 ! "

Originally Posted by Fountz

I'm sure it was Zagallo who asked by a reporter after he'd subbed the Keeper.. something along the lines of..

"Do you not know who your best Goalkeeper is ? "

he replied.

" I do, but he already plays at Number 10 ! "

A bit like the White Pele then....

Originally Posted by Fountz

I'm sure it was Zagallo who asked by a reporter after he'd subbed the Keeper.. something along the lines of..

"Do you not know who your best Goalkeeper is ? "

he replied.

" I do, but he already plays at Number 10 ! "

I remember hearing that he actually played in goal three or four times in his career. Supposedly didn't concede a single goal either. Not sure if that's true or not.

Originally Posted by Serenity Now

I think you're underestimating how good a trainer Pele was. He would practice all the technical aspects of his game for hours on his own after team training. And I understand that preparation in Brazil, for the national team at least, was perhaps the most advanced in the world at the time.

You might see a marginal improvement in terms of some of the physical aspects of his game with modern methods, but technically I really don't think so. He was close to perfect, in any case.

You also have to consider that South American football was in a very different state back then. The mass exodus that exists today simply was not a factor then. Imagine virtually all of the South American players in Europe today playing in their own countries. That was the reality in those days.

And Pele also played regularly against top class European opposition in exhibition matches, as Santos toured around the world to raise revenues. These matches were very competitive as well, much more so than most friendly matches today.

You're certainly correct on the refereeing angle though. Although Pele wasn't adverse to throwing his weight (or his elbows) around when required.It's obviously impossible to say whether all the money flying around today would have had an effect on his hunger and desire for the game, but Pele faced a tremendous pressure to perform, both for Santos and for Brazil. In my opinion, comparable to anything the major stars face today.

He also had to deal with most of the temptations that a modern footballer would, in terms of women etc.

With training, I was refering to improving his physical attributes, ie speed, strength, stamina from an earlier age, avoiding injuries and training enough to keep him ticking over all the time, the modern techniques that seem to enable footballers to run forever, I wasn't doubting his fitness then, I'm sure he would benefit though.

A move into Europe now, even with Brazillian football at the level it was then, would benefit him in terms of learning a different style of football, playing in different conditions, with rather than against, the European style.

The World Cup in '66 could well have had a diffenrent ending had referee's prevented teams from kicking him out of the tournament.

Plus improvements to boots, balls, pitches, stadiums, all would benefit him. If Frank Lampard can score so many from distance, and Clarence Seedorf similar, Pele would be pinging them in from all over!

Good posts SN (as usual). At the moment the fashion is to underrate Pele and claim that other players were better. This will change as people seek for a new opinion to show themselves apart from the current popular opinion. I haven't seen huge amounts of footage of Pele playing, but from that which i have seen, along with the multitude of documentaries and player testimonies he appears to be the greatest player ever, and by some distance. He had no weaknesses at all, pace, power, vision, strength, aerial ability, skill, technique, stamina, leadership, bottle, professionalism, completely two footed and a superb eye for goal. As SN alluded to he was often cited as the first true professional, it was he who really took training and fitness to new levels at a time when other players were very half arsed about such things. It could be argued his Brazil side invented the modern era of football, with their increased tactical awareness and emphasis on training and fitness. You also have to admire the longevity of his career; players like Maradona and Cruyff were at their peak briefly for a few years, but Pele was the winner and star of two world cups 12 years apart.

Originally Posted by Serenity Now

He also had the audacity to try things that no-one else would even think of.

Was it against Uruguay, in 1970, when he let the ball pass the keeper, ran round him and tried to score.

To this day, it remains one of the most astonishing pieces of skill I've ever seen. Simply fantastic.

A truly great player.

Originally Posted by The Watcher

Was it against Uruguay, in 1970, when he let the ball pass the keeper, ran round him and tried to score.

To this day, it remains one of the most astonishing pieces of skill I've ever seen. Simply fantastic.

A truly great player.

Yeah he missed though the idiot

[YOUTUBE]AWD1JrcUVq8[/YOUTUBE]

Originally Posted by The Watcher

Was it against Uruguay, in 1970, when he let the ball pass the keeper, ran round him and tried to score.

To this day, it remains one of the most astonishing pieces of skill I've ever seen. Simply fantastic.

Yep. That was sensational. Another moment I remember from 1970 was a fantastic back-heel flick to Tostao that he made without looking. I think it was against Peru.

Originally Posted by DinGbAt

At the moment the fashion is to underrate Pele and claim that other players were better.

I don't mind that, as long as it's Maradona

His goal in the '58 World Cup Final. Knocks it over the defender, then volleys it in. £#%&!ing brilliant. And he was 17. 17 for £#%&! sake and scored one of the best goals ever seen in a World Cup Final. You have to be a very special player to do something like that.

Originally Posted by Baron_van_Marlon

& the pass at the end of that move in the final - the arrogance & serene vision to not even look... a 5 yard pass made to look beautiful. He was the %@#$&!s, full stop.

That whole move is a joy to watch, but I agree, that pass is simply outstanding.