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Unread 23-10-2016, 07:44 PM
Marvel7
 
Default Formation and team selections

This is where our problems come from. Sure there are players in the squad that should be shot in the centre circle but I honestly believe we have enough to be better than we are if the right players are picked in the right positions.

Valencia at right back is far from perfect but his form has been good this season, honestly how many from the prem would you take over him? 1 or 2 at most.

Shaw at left back, form has been poor but he is a quality player, needs his form and confidence managing after last seasons injury, doesn't need singling out after a defeat.

Smalling and Bailley at centre back (pre injury of course) is a decent pairing, Smalling had a bad game today but was protected by one holding midfielder that's not a holding midfielder. As a pair there aren't many in the league you would swap for.

Midfield should be a 3, Herrera, Carrick, Pogba. Both Herrera and Pogba would be better suited to a 3, neither are completely comfortable in a 2. Full backs provide width and the outside forwards drop in so as not to be outnumbered.

Front 3 of martial (left) Rashford (centre) and maybe one day Mikhitaryan (right) but until then Lingard.

Not a perfect 11 but certainly capable of performing a hell of a lot better than we are right now.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 07:49 PM
Jez Quigley
 
Thumbs up

I agree with your team too - I think that has to be where we should be heading.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 08:01 PM
utd99
 
Default

No formation in the world is proof against individual performances like that.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 08:03 PM
Switching Off
 
Default

It's about players before formations. It's staging that Carrick isn't get more games but soon enough the press will cotton on and be clamouring for his selection, and then the pressure on him to immediately turn things around will be ridiculous.

Also wondering why Schneiderlin never gets a look in. Geanted he's no worldie but hes a decent midfielder with a lot of experience. Surely couldn't be worse than Fellaini.

The persistence with that Belgian @#%&! is horrifying.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 08:04 PM
Buck
 
Default

He started Fellaini to stop Chelsea from playing: to be a spoiler.

That game-plan went out of the window after 40 seconds.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 08:04 PM
utd99
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Switching Off
It's about players before formations. It's staging that Carrick isn't get more games but soon enough the press will cotton on and be clamouring for his selection, and then the pressure on him to immediately turn things around will be ridiculous.

Also wondering why Schneiderlin never gets a look in. Geanted he's no worldie but hes a decent midfielder with a lot of experience. Surely couldn't be worse than Fellaini.

The persistence with that Belgian @#%&! is horrifying.
This, This, and thrice This...
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 08:08 PM
Marvel7
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buck
He started Fellaini to stop Chelsea from playing: to be a spoiler.

That game-plan went out of the window after 40 seconds.
Nope, we essentially played 4-1-4-1 first half today. Herrera was the 1, Fellaini was alongside Pogba behind Zlatan, wasn't there to be a spoiler. Playing Herrera as a solitary holding midfielder is a disgraceful decision from the manager, maybe worse than picking Fellaini as an attacking midfielder.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 08:09 PM
Mr_Ed
 
Default

The whole thing is baffling... No Shaw, no Mickey, Fellaini playing, Lingard starting ahead of Martial etc etc. There's something just not right at the moment.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 08:10 PM
utd99
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvel7
Nope, we essentially played 4-1-4-1 first half today. Herrera was the 1, Fellaini was alongside Pogba behind Zlatan, wasn't there to be a spoiler. Playing Herrera as a solitary holding midfielder is a disgraceful decision from the manager, maybe worse than picking Fellaini as an attacking midfielder.
I think it's more likely Fellaini was just mostly out of position. It would be in keeping with his holocaust of a performance.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 08:12 PM
Marvel7
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Switching Off
It's about players before formations.

Also wondering why Schneiderlin never gets a look in. Surely couldn't be worse than Fellaini.
The persistence with that Belgian c*** is horrifying.
It's not though, the formation and style is key, you can have the best 11 players in the world but if you use them wrong they will struggle, we are using players wrong. Make the best of what we have short term, slowly build towards whatever the end plan is, but get the basics right to start with.

But yeah the bit about Fellaini is spot on.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 08:13 PM
Ranier Wolfcastle
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by utd99
No formation in the world is proof against individual performances like that.
Yes but his point is probably a general one, and a good one at that.

Our team selections and set ups make things harder for us.

We play clowns in defence.

Fellaini in midfield.

And a striker with little movement or pace.

The team in the original post would solve some problems.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 09:04 PM
MJ Ramone
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranier Wolfcastle
Yes but his point is probably a general one, and a good one at that.

Our team selections and set ups make things harder for us.

We play clowns in defence.

Fellaini in midfield.

And a striker with little movement or pace.

The team in the original post would solve some problems.
it might do... but what if it didn't?
Then what?
Then we all start picking teams with our 'dream buys' in & start talking about the next window.
Di maria will make everything alright
Pogba will make everything alright
Griezeman will make everything alright
etc..

We've run out of United players at the Club.
Rooney & Carrick are the last link to a great side and Fergie is no longer here.

It's going to take £#%&!ing years & we'll all piss & moan about it on here as long as it takes.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 09:48 PM
jem
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Buck
He started Fellaini to stop Chelsea from playing: to be a spoiler.

That game-plan went out of the window after 40 seconds.
how can you even type those words without hating mourinho?

his game plan was only fit to be slung out of the window. he is anti-football.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 09:54 PM
Marvel7
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by MJ Ramone
It's going to take £#%&!ing years & we'll all piss & moan about it on here as long as it takes.
But why does it have to take years? The team posted is a good team, if used right it would be capable of challenging for the premier league. If the club is then run with some kind of a plan it shouldn't take years to get back to challenging at the top of European football.

Player recruitment is one such place where the club needs a plan, identifying what we actually need and how we intend to use them. For years now we have bough players with no plan of how we are gonna use them.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 10:01 PM
AK14
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvel7
But why does it have to take years? The team posted is a good team, if used right it would be capable of challenging for the premier league. If the club is then run with some kind of a plan it shouldn't take years to get back to challenging at the top of European football.

Player recruitment is one such place where the club needs a plan, identifying what we actually need and how we intend to use them. For years now we have bough players with no plan of how we are gonna use them.
Nah that team wouldn't be good enough to challenge for a title and it's not just a team of eleven players that challenge for a league it takes a squad (unless you're Leicester)

Out of that starting line up-

Smalling isn't good enough
Lingard isn't good enough
Carrick is 35 and can't play every week
Rashford is 18 and to rely on an 18 year old to be your main goal scorer would be madness

We SHOULD be challenging for a champions league spot and that sadly is where we belong at this moment

Agree about player recruitment.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 10:03 PM
marlo
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AK14
Nah that team wouldn't be good enough to challenge for a title and it's not just a team of eleven players that challenge for a league it takes a squad (unless you're Leicester)

Out of that starting line up-

Smalling isn't good enough
Lingard isn't good enough
Carrick is 35 and can't play every week
Rashford is 18 and to rely on an 18 year old to be your main goal scorer would be madness

We SHOULD be challenging for a champions league spot and that sadly is where we belong at this moment.
one of the main things i can't understand on here.
he is NOWHERE near good enough to be our main striker. would be absolute suicidal. at the moment he isn't showing much more than running with the ball, most times quite aimlessly.
it would be like city playing kelechi as their main striker... (they are both similar age and at the same level ability wise....)
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 10:06 PM
AK14
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by marlo
one of the main things i can't understand on here.
he is NOWHERE near good enough to be our main striker. would be absolute suicidal. at the moment he isn't showing much more than running with the ball, most times quite aimlessly.
it would be like city playing kelechi as their main striker... (they are both similar age and at the same level ability wise....)
Not sure it's about him not being good enough

It's about trusting an 18 year old kid who will likely (just like every other 18 year old player) dip in and out of form.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 10:11 PM
Tumescent Throb
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marvel7
This is where our problems come from. Sure there are players in the squad that should be shot in the centre circle but I honestly believe we have enough to be better than we are if the right players are picked in the right positions.

Valencia at right back is far from perfect but his form has been good this season, honestly how many from the prem would you take over him? 1 or 2 at most.

Shaw at left back, form has been poor but he is a quality player, needs his form and confidence managing after last seasons injury, doesn't need singling out after a defeat.

Smalling and Bailley at centre back (pre injury of course) is a decent pairing, Smalling had a bad game today but was protected by one holding midfielder that's not a holding midfielder. As a pair there aren't many in the league you would swap for.

Midfield should be a 3, Herrera, Carrick, Pogba. Both Herrera and Pogba would be better suited to a 3, neither are completely comfortable in a 2. Full backs provide width and the outside forwards drop in so as not to be outnumbered.

Front 3 of martial (left) Rashford (centre) and maybe one day Mikhitaryan (right) but until then Lingard.

Not a perfect 11 but certainly capable of performing a hell of a lot better than we are right now.
if you're going to be champions there should be literally none.

and if you're going to challenge next season in the CL as well then even less than none.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 10:17 PM
marlo
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by AK14
Not sure it's about him not being good enough

It's about trusting an 18 year old kid who will likely (just like every other 18 year old player) dip in and out of form.
he isn't good enough at this early stage is his career, he has played about 25 first team games ffs.
he is young and wouldn't be starting games at any of our title rivals so why the hell should he be starting games for us.

he should be treated like kelechi, brought on if a goal is needed, or once we are need to change things and allowed to develop his game.

in the last few games he has been as poor as rooney was before he was dropped and its not his fault as he is a young player but its obvious he should be starting games.
he was tried up front in that europa game we lost...and was bullied and a (-1) in terms of presence up front.
 
Unread 23-10-2016, 10:21 PM
red in cumbria
 
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by utd99
No formation in the world is proof against individual performances like that.
Especially not conceding in the first minute like that. Genuinely, wtf were they doing??
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