At one stage we had midfielders Robbo, Ince and Keane in the squad

Now we don't have a midfielder comparable in style, ability or even mentality to any of them in the squad.

I suppose Morgan is the closest but he's more a beta character like Carrick rather than an alpha midfield warrior.

Remember the days of "Earning the right to play" where United would first out fight and then out play even the most aggressive of sides.

We had Hughes fighting their defenders too.

I know the game has changed but Smalling seems to be one of the few that relishes a physical battle.



Should've kept Pobga or signed Wanyama (off to spurs shorty) or something.

We're very, very soft.

Not sure what exactly Schweini did but he went down as if his leg was broken. Herrera got a bit of a knock in the face at one point and looked as though he was about to cry. Fellaini is an absolute blanket for a supposed big guy.

I think the game has moved on a lot and these type of all round all action midfielders aren't really required anymore, similarly the good old fashioned winger types aren't really in huge demand at the top level.

Originally Posted by Hong Kong Eric

I think the game has moved on a lot and these type of all round all action midfielders aren't really required anymore, similarly the good old fashioned winger types aren't really in huge demand at the top level.

Thanks for that.

Why aren't we doing better, then?

Desperately need some proper midfielders tbh.

Schneidlerin will be good for us, the rest could all be £#%&!ed off right now. 2 finished and the other one £#%&!ing toss.

Worried about the Schweinsteiger signing at the time, we needed legs, vitality, zest.. Not another calm and cool pair of ageing legs

Like Keano said in that interview, those 3 would play against Butt and Scholes in training too.

I always used to advocate Parker/Frings - we really need that type of character in this team.

Originally Posted by Hong Kong Eric

I think the game has moved on a lot and these type of all round all action midfielders aren't really required anymore, similarly the good old fashioned winger types aren't really in huge demand at the top level.

The game has moved on but great combative midfielders are still a part of great sides. That's way pochettino is trying to buy wanyama, that's why city are shit if yaya is shit, that's why bayern bought vidal. Look at the champions chelsea, Matic is(was) a destroyer. All great sides inculde players who enjoy the combative side.

I'm not sure on the stats but I'd guess most goals are scored because someone has broken up play and basically set off a counter.

Originally Posted by red in cumbria

Thanks for that.

Why aren't we doing better, then?

Lack of mobility around them? Playing 2 holders when perhaps only 1 is needed? Lack of freedom given to those who play there? A poor link up striker? Lack of trust in the defence so playing more cautious?

Lack of quality recruitment? I never really rated Schneiderlin, jack of all trades master of none. Schweinsteiger best days are gone.

Could be a host of things pal.

Plus it gets the crowd going - drives energy. But careful, you're advocating 'blood and fundoh' when the sages are saying that that type of play is from the dark ages.

Tbh there so many things lacking from this team that it's difficult to know where to start.

atletico haven't done too badly being combative and neither have most sides played us this season

Originally Posted by Hong Kong Eric

I think the game has moved on a lot and these type of all round all action midfielders aren't really required anymore, similarly the good old fashioned winger types aren't really in huge demand at the top level.

Lol, Keane and rob no would walk straight into any side in Europe at their peak and I am including barca, Madrid and Bayern.

Originally Posted by armchair

The game has moved on but great combative midfielders are still a part of great sides. That's way pochettino is trying to buy wanyama, that's why city are shit if yaya is shit, that's why bayern bought vidal. Look at the champions chelsea, Matic is(was) a destroyer. All great sides inculde players who enjoy the combative side.

I'm not sure on the stats but I'd guess most goals are scored because someone has broken up play and basically set off a counter.

Wanyama and Matic are both holding types, so i wouldn't say they were similar to the players you mentioned in the OP.

Toure and Vidal are 2 of the remaining few all action marauding midfielders for me, but i still wouldn't say they are similar to the players you mentioned as they play with more freedom and get into all kinds of positions rather than being a box to box type.

Coquelin's a bit of a yard dog but can't deny his impact on Arsenal. I think over the year he's improved on the ball too.

There's always room for that type of midfielder but we're in an era where versatility is heralded over someone with a specific skill-set.

Over the years, going back to Fergie's final seasons, I feel we had too many jack of all trades master of none players. Moyes and Van Gaal both love these players so nothing's changed.

Originally Posted by armchair

atletico haven't done too badly being combative and neither have most sides played us this season

Tbf, they have those rare players who can get stuck in and can play a bit.

Should be raiding them hard.. Koke, Griezmann, Godin.. Angel Correa..

Originally Posted by Buck

Coquelin's a bit of a yard dog but can't deny his impact on Arsenal. I think over the year he's improved on the ball too.

There's always room for that type of midfielder but we're in an era where versatility is heralded over someone with a specific skill-set.

Over the years, going back to Fergie's final seasons, I feel we had too many jack of all trades master of none players. Moyes and Van Gaal both love these players so nothing's changed.

Again although he is a combative midfielder but like previously said is he similar to those mentioned in the OP? I wouldn't say so.

Does anybody here think Keane or Robbo would be tactically astute enough to play in a position that demanded they sit in front of the 2 central defenders and cover that space, leaving it very very rarely. I think Ince could have probably done so due to his time in Italy where the games were always a lot more tactically astute and still are.

Originally Posted by Hong Kong Eric

Again although he is a combative midfielder but like previously said is he similar to those mentioned in the OP? I wouldn't say so.

Does anybody here think Keane or Robbo would be tactically astute enough to play in a position that demanded they sit in front of the 2 central defenders and cover that space, leaving it very very rarely. I think Ince could have probably done so due to his time in Italy where the games were always a lot more tactically astute and still are.

Yeah, Ince was definitely more tactically astute than Keane tbf.

Originally Posted by Hong Kong Eric

Wanyama and Matic are both holding types, so i wouldn't say they were similar to the players you mentioned in the OP.

Toure and Vidal are 2 of the remaining few all action marauding midfielders for me, but i still wouldn't say they are similar to the players you mentioned as they play with more freedom and get into all kinds of positions rather than being a box to box type.

The point is sides need combative players and we have none. Other sides have plenty. If you are saying Keane, Ince or Robbo just wouldn't be able to play in today's game then you are mad. They are all good enough players to still be combative yet fulfil their roles in the team regardless of the tactic of the day. If you transported yaya back to 1993 he'd be able to adapt too - he'd probably roll around for the first few weeks and complain about the wages but in the end he'd be good enough to play.

miss that era. their attitude defined united as much as their talent. not sure you get that anymore; there are players who fit the schema in terms of technical ability but i can't really think of anyone as exacting as them.

hughes as well, remember him fronting the crowd in that swindon game where eric got sent off

Originally Posted by Hong Kong Eric

Again although he is a combative midfielder but like previously said is he similar to those mentioned in the OP? I wouldn't say so.

Does anybody here think Keane or Robbo would be tactically astute enough to play in a position that demanded they sit in front of the 2 central defenders and cover that space, leaving it very very rarely. I think Ince could have probably done so due to his time in Italy where the games were always a lot more tactically astute and still are.

they could do it with their eyes shut. I'm going to sound like an old @#%&!, but Robson was twice the player of any midfielder I Europe at the moment I that he was both defensive and offensive midfielder. It was one role. Min these days of increased fitness I don't see why the role is split. Apart from the art of being a box to box midfielder being lost.

Originally Posted by Ethers

Yeah, Ince was definitely more tactically astute than Keane tbf.

He did have a bit of Stevie G about him, made him great to watch but occasionally daft. Everton cup final 95, left us totally open to the counter which won the game for them.

Schweinstieger made that one great run in the first half today, showed us what we are missing in that area, legs and running power, we are terrible on the counter because so few of our team can cover the ground quickly enough.

Improved a little with Depay and Lingard on.