Ibracadabra

Originally Posted by hollowman

of the three main young argentine players..(aguero, tevez and messi), who would you say the argentine public / media like the best..?

They're all very popular, they all get huge coverage in the papers and on TV, but overall I would definitely say Messi, with Tevez and Kun currently about equal. Messi is certainly the one who gets the most marketing push too. Although the answer does depend to a significant extent on who you support - for example, almost all Boca fans, a sizeable percentage of the population, absolutely adore Tevez.

Originally Posted by Serenity Now

Would love to see how Berbatov and Zlatan would be rated if the Bulgarian plied his trade in Italy, while Ibrahimovic played in the Premiership.

Berbatov -- plays for european and premier league champions
Zlatan -- plays for the "nearly men" and champions of italy because of betting.

You should get the drift.

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

I'm sure Zlatan would be rated if he played over here. The problem with him at the moment is that most people in this country don't get to watch him, but because everyone has to have a firm opinion on everything, the assurances from the pundits on BBC, Sky etc here that Zlatan is rubbish seem to have pretty much formed the consensus.

Tune in to Keys and whatever idiots he has with him tomorrow when they’ll look at Zlatan’s goal and proceed to talk utter %@#$&!s about him, despite probably none of them having watched him play even once this season.

Then Souness will have a go at Francesco Totti....

Or is it because every time he plays in champions league he is utterly useless. Even against the most pathetic of teams.

Or shall we just blame it on the pundits?

Er, he scored five goals in seven matches in the Champions League last season. Now I realise goals aren't everything, but that's hardly utterly useless, is it?

I'm not blaming the pundits for anything. I'm just saying that when it comes to Ibrahimovic, they tend to talk out of their arses a fair bit.

Originally Posted by Serenity Now

YouTube - Best pass ever!

Shit.

Didn't even create a chance. Unlike this:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=1tDkYuDAwBs

Can't watch You Tube in work but is that one from Valeron? He was a £#%&!ing good player.

Originally Posted by Whalefish

Can't watch You Tube in work but is that one from Valeron? He was a £#%&!ing good player.

Yes, through ball for Makaay.

seems like zlatan shares your opinions as far as reporters go...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=On100ZtKa_E

berbatov and zlatan are very similar players with similar temperaments, of course, and it's really a matter of personal preference who you prefer, i suppose.

a lot of the 'firm opinions' on here about zlatan are just wind ups aimed at marlo, tbh. one plays for united, the other one doesn't, so one is a moody genius and the other a lazy @#%&!.

fans always have double standards about things like this. saha, berbatov and hargreaves all agitate for a move to ot and it's fine, it's the clubs' fault for £#%&!ing the players around, not accepting they have kept to their contract and now want to move on... ronnie does far less and...

Originally Posted by borsuk

berbatov and zlatan are very similar players with similar temperaments, of course, and it's really a matter of personal preference who you prefer, i suppose.

a lot of the 'firm opinions' on here about zlatan are just wind ups aimed at marlo, tbh. one plays for united, the other one doesn't, so one is a moody genius and the other a lazy @#%&!.

fans always have double standards about things like this. saha, berbatov and hargreaves all agitate for a move to ot and it's fine, it's the clubs' fault for £#%&!ing the players around, not accepting they have kept to their contract and now want to move on... ronnie does far less and...

I don't know, even before he signed for us Berbatov was very highly rated, both on here and by the media. I even remember an article from Tony Cascarino dubbing him the new Van Basten. Zlatan, on the other hand, has never had anywhere near as positive a reputation in the UK; in fact, most people seem to think he's shit/overrated, and the view the media and pundits have of him seems to be pretty much the same. I'm not saying Ibrahimovic is as good as or better than Berbatov, or vice versa, but to view one as a genius and the other as shit strikes me as something that should at least be causing some cognitive dissonance.

I wanted United to sign him from Ajax after the pre-season friendly when they beat us, Mido scored I think

It's only recent performances, particularly against English opposition, that have led me to think he isn't all he's cracked up to be or all he should be.

I definitely clas shim in the same bracket as Berbatov as in type of player, hence the earlier in the thread, Marlo hates Berbatov and loves Ibrahimovic, yet they are much of a muchness in the way they play, it's irrational.

At least the rest of the Berbatov haters on the board tend to dislike Berbatov as well.

Originally Posted by Serenity Now

I don't know, even before he signed for us Berbatov was very highly rated, both on here and by the media. I even remember an article from Tony Cascarino dubbing him the new Van Basten. Zlatan, on the other hand, has never had anywhere near as positive a reputation in the UK; in fact, most people seem to think he's shit/overrated, and the view the media and pundits have of him seems to be pretty much the same. I'm not saying Ibrahimovic is as good as or better than Berbatov, or vice versa, but to view one as a genius and the other as shit strikes me as something that should at least be causing some cognitive dissonance.

fair comments, but was berbatov rated before he came to spurs? the english media really are insular beyond belief at times - even for the very best it is only a match-winning performance against an english team which cements their greatness

Originally Posted by borsuk

fair comments, but was berbatov rated before he came to spurs? the english media really are insular beyond belief at times - even for the very best it is only a match-winning performance against an english team which cements their greatness

very true. pavelekenco(sp) for examaple.

The useless £#%&!er was at it again this weekend. Dug Inter out the shit with two goals after Chievo had come from 2-0 down to pull it back to 2-2 at the San Siro.

Second one was a decent hit:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=PgJoV4IHfwo&feature=related

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=AGjwe4iJt_U

I'm not that arsed about the Dutch league, teams below PSV and Ajax aren't normally the best, but you can only beat what's in front of you and that goal he scored for Ajax (the one on you tube that gets stuck up a lot) was £#%&!ing brilliant.

The opinion in the British press seemed to snowball after Martin O'Neil slagged him off.

Oh - and whenever I do see him play I keep thinking of this song. I have absolutely no idea why:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vouDK-LELEU

80s soft rock, he should've been in a band IMO.

Originally Posted by Whalefish

The opinion in the British press seemed to snowball after Martin O'Neil slagged him off.

At World Cup? Without a doubt. Zlatan had come off a fairly poor second season at Juve, having been outstanding in his debut year. He then struggled a little at the World Cup with Sweden. O'Neill had a few pops and that was pretty much it for him as far as the media over here was concerned. He joined Inter later that summer and has been quite brilliant for most of the time ever since.

He's in some form now, though. Seems to be providing a highlight reel moment in every game these days.

I don't watch much football other than Utd games atm () so not seen him play but he seems to have had a good couple of seasons. Certainly been scoring goals.

Ahhh, goals. Those where the days.

But I can't go for that, (No can do)
No, I can't go for that, (No can do)
Oh, I can't go for that, (No can do)
I can't go for that, can't go for that, can't go for that.

on a completely different note, watched lyon - marseille last night. om were all over them (60% of the ball away from home against lyon is some going) but it finished 0-0 a la united. benzema gave one of the best demonstrations of the lone striker role i've seen in years, with his midfield pressed way back and bugger all support he was outstanding in finding space, offering for the pass, holding the ball up, laying it off - one square ball across the area in the second half was absolutely exquisitely done and perfectly timed for the runner, who proceeded to £#%&! it up horribly - and carrying the ball forward with driving runs. absolutely superb, he was, and never stopped, right up to the final whistle. exactly what we are missing.

He'll be the best striker in world football in a couple of years. One of the few strikers I've seen bully Vidic and Rio.

Originally Posted by borsuk

on a completely different note, watched lyon - marseille last night. om were all over them (60% of the ball away from home against lyon is some going) but it finished 0-0 a la united. benzema gave one of the best demonstrations of the lone striker role i've seen in years, with his midfield pressed way back and bugger all support he was outstanding in finding space, offering for the pass, holding the ball up, laying it off - one square ball across the area in the second half was absolutely exquisitely done and perfectly timed for the runner, who proceeded to £#%&! it up horribly - and carrying the ball forward with driving runs. absolutely superb, he was, and never stopped, right up to the final whistle. exactly what we are missing.

For me, this was actually one of the big issues with regard to the Berbatov signing. By buying him I think we've pretty much put ourselves out of the running for Benzema when he leaves Lyon, probably at the end of the season. I don't know whether Benzema was in fact the first choice and if so whether Fergie considered waiting a year for him, but it'll be hard to stomach him going elsewhere next summer, especially if Berbatov doesn't settle. As Whalefish said, he'll probably be the best in the business in a couple of years; and, as you say, he is absolutely perfect for United.

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

For me, this was actually one of the big issues with regard to the Berbatov signing. By buying him I think we've pretty much put ourselves out of the running for Benzema when he leaves Lyon, probably at the end of the season. I don't know whether Benzema was in fact the first choice and if so whether Fergie considered waiting a year for him, but it'll be hard to stomach him going elsewhere next summer, especially if Berbatov doesn't settle. As Whalefish said, he'll probably be the best in the business in a couple of years; and, as you say, he is absolutely perfect for United.

Bang on.

However, I think we'd have to lose Tevez too - as well as (not sign) Berbatov - to accomadate him.