Utd's Current Style and Tactics: WTF is Going On

Originally Posted by dunk

We've conceded 1 goal in the last 8 and a half hours or something...

We just need to dominate the middle with the three who are comfortable with one touch passing, 2 out of the 3 wide players will sort it and it'd be nice to see Rooney atcually playing up front.

Play like that and we'll win the league by at least 5 points.

Ferie out.

Originally Posted by Crumps

We just need to dominate the middle with the three who are comfortable with one touch passing, 2 out of the 3 wide players will sort it and it'd be nice to see Rooney atcually playing up front.

Play like that and we'll win the league by at least 5 points.

exactly, 5-4-1 rio as sweeper, rooney as deep lying catenatio/sivadore/fake no.9

Originally Posted by bored

exactly, 5-4-1 rio as sweeper, rooney as deep lying catenatio/sivadore/fake no.9

4-5-1

Back 4 with Raf has been sound Carrick doing his job with Scholes and Clevs in there too. Wingers on form, Rooney up top.

5 at the back is something Italians and @#%&! do.

You Italian pal?

un poco, posoillisimmo

Fergie worried me after the Blackburn game. Sounded like he didn't like what he saw when we played 4-3-3. I fear we're headed for this shite again next season.

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

Fergie worried me after the Blackburn game. Sounded like he didn't like what he saw when we played 4-3-3. I fear we're headed for this shite again next season.

It's like 'how shit do we have to do for some billionaires to manage to beat us'

Originally Posted by ZiggyStardust

I think after tonight's "performance" we need to seriously discuss what has happened to our style of play and tactics.

For many years Fergie tried to get us to play a more fluid and controlled style of passing football for better results in europe.
It took awhile and some disappoints but between 2006-07 to 2009-10 we finally seemed to have cracked it.

For some bizare reason Fergie decided last season to go back to a rigid 442 formation again after all hard work getting us to play another type of football.

This has continued into this season and even though we may stilll win the league it has been depressing to watch.

So why do you think Fergie has gone back to 442 and what does the coming seasons hold for our style of play and tactics

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

Fergie worried me after the Blackburn game. Sounded like he didn't like what he saw when we played 4-3-3. I fear we're headed for this shite again next season.

It's a good job we've got a good number 2 then isn't it...

Utd have too many limited players in the attacking group. Valencia for example, brilliant at what he does and against an opponent he feels confident against he can be an absolute bully, but he can only really play as an out and out wide right player, lacks variation in his game and when he comes in off the wing he can look lost. The fact that he has become such a key player this season is contributing to the dull unimaginative football. Having said that he is infinitely better than Young who seems to only have 2 main tactics, whipped in cross and the dive. He has scored some fine goals coming in off his right foot but again he is extremely predictable

Hernandez is only really effective when he has space to run into, not capable of getting involved in build up play beyond the simple. Recently there have been examples of the midfield being unwilling to pass to him because he struggles to control a ball back to goal unless it is deadweight. Again hard for a team to look to build a style when one of the main strikers is so lacking in technical ability, which means all the play goes down the wings to stay away from this flaw.

Even Rooney contributes to this. He has become so predictable in his play from that deeper role, drops deep to give himself time to protect his unreliable touch, spins to his right and plays the ball to the right wing for Valencia or the RB, so easy to read. I wish he would show more aggression in his play, pick up the ball and drive at the defence, he used to be so dangerous in that mode, not terrifically skilful but strong and powerful and hard to stop. he just does not run at defenders now.

At least Nani is back, as frustrating as he is, he needs to be a key player in this team, given a lot more freedom to roam and make things happen, great feet in tight areas, ability to go either way, shoot off both feet. He has much more to his game than putting crosses in.

That first few games feels like a mirage, all the interplay, change of positions, energy from midfield, tempo

limited valencia again ffs

the problem last night was £#%&! all to do with valencia. the problem last night, as it has been most of the season, was the midfield without scholes and the attack without rooney as he was shunted back out of position to compensate for the shite in midfield.

442:



not sure what the tactics are. We're hopeless without the ball as has been seen in two european competitions against traditionally far inferior opposition.

But we depend on keeping the ball with as rigid a 442 as possible. This may be possible with scholes but that just can't last, how they've stopped putting a man on scholes like they did before his retirement is beyond me.

There is not style. it's shit on a stick football. No intricate football we seen in the past. Give it to the bloodeh wingohs and lash int box. there's a reason we're top in england and hopeless in europe. They can actually play football in europe.

it might be 4-4-2 if rooney was anywhere near the penalty area. a lot of the time he's behind the nominal midfielders, it's nothing like 4-4-2.

Originally Posted by borsuk

it might be 4-4-2 if rooney was anywhere near the penalty area. a lot of the time he's behind the nominal midfielders, it's nothing like 4-4-2.

Two deep lying midfielders, two wingers, two forwards with one dropping deep. Maybe too deep at times to get more space but it's 442. It's nothing else but 442.

Originally Posted by Fuzzy Dunlop

Two deep lying midfielders, two wingers, two forwards with one dropping deep. Maybe too deep at times to get more space but it's 442. It's nothing else but 442.

rooney's not played as a forward for a while. don't know if it's a lack of discipline in his play, going looking for the ball instead of giving an option to others, or instructions from fergie, or a combination, but what we've been actually doing on the field hasn't been any kind of 4-4-2.

i'd like us to play rooney on his own up top tbh, force him to play up the field and give us solidity behind. nani left, valencia right, cleverley, scholes and carrick behind

Originally Posted by borsuk

i'd like us to play rooney on his own up top tbh, force him to play up the field and give us solidity behind. nani left, valencia right, cleverley, scholes and carrick behind

100% agreed.

we tried something similar with rooney left and jones inside valencia at blackburn.

Because rooney was out left and kept drifting inside and jones was hopeless at getting forward it left evra and valencia isolated.

But with Rooney up front, nani left and cleverly on the right of a midfield three it would have a far better balance.

Won't happen though, it seems saf has given up on it and will go for a safe 442. which reaps benefits against shit but will always be exposed against decent teams.

Not seen the game, but listened on the radio.

Carrick !! was he playing ? ...any good ?

Originally Posted by borsuk

limited valencia again ffs

the problem last night was £#%&! all to do with valencia. the problem last night, as it has been most of the season, was the midfield without scholes and the attack without rooney as he was shunted back out of position to compensate for the shite in midfield.

Valencia is limited Bors. That does not mean he is a bad player, far from it, but he does lack variation in his game. Utd have been not been that good to watch even with Scholes in the team, much more control of the play but the style has been bludgeoning teams through pressure and volume as much as quality. Valencia has been the only constantly reliable out pass in that time so Utd have played through him. Valencia himself probably suffers from this as well, a lot of physical pressure on him as the main threat.

The midfield was awful last night of course, Giggs especially but worrying signs that Carrick looks a little jaded as well.

Originally Posted by borsuk

limited valencia again ffs

the problem last night was £#%&! all to do with valencia. the problem last night, as it has been most of the season, was the midfield without scholes and the attack without rooney as he was shunted back out of position to compensate for the shite in midfield.

Spot on, I dunno why Fergie won't learn this season, the evidenve is there for any @#%&! to see. There's £#%&! all we can do about the squad as it is now but we could at least try and get the best out of wha we've got.

Originally Posted by Tiberian

Utd have too many limited players in the attacking group. Valencia for example, brilliant at what he does and against an opponent he feels confident against he can be an absolute bully, but he can only really play as an out and out wide right player, lacks variation in his game and when he comes in off the wing he can look lost. The fact that he has become such a key player this season is contributing to the dull unimaginative football. Having said that he is infinitely better than Young who seems to only have 2 main tactics, whipped in cross and the dive. He has scored some fine goals coming in off his right foot but again he is extremely predictable

Hernandez is only really effective when he has space to run into, not capable of getting involved in build up play beyond the simple. Recently there have been examples of the midfield being unwilling to pass to him because he struggles to control a ball back to goal unless it is deadweight. Again hard for a team to look to build a style when one of the main strikers is so lacking in technical ability, which means all the play goes down the wings to stay away from this flaw.

Even Rooney contributes to this. He has become so predictable in his play from that deeper role, drops deep to give himself time to protect his unreliable touch, spins to his right and plays the ball to the right wing for Valencia or the RB, so easy to read. I wish he would show more aggression in his play, pick up the ball and drive at the defence, he used to be so dangerous in that mode, not terrifically skilful but strong and powerful and hard to stop. he just does not run at defenders now.

At least Nani is back, as frustrating as he is, he needs to be a key player in this team, given a lot more freedom to roam and make things happen, great feet in tight areas, ability to go either way, shoot off both feet. He has much more to his game than putting crosses in.

That first few games feels like a mirage, all the interplay, change of positions, energy from midfield, tempo

Excellent post.