More Van Gaal philosophy discussion

Originally Posted by rustling jimmies

When did he win his last major trophy? Genuine question btw

In his last club job.

Originally Posted by rustling jimmies

LVG can ram his "philosophy"

If It was Brenton he would be ridiculed tbh

In what world is Van Gaal not being ridiculed?

Originally Posted by rustling jimmies

LVG can ram his "philosophy"

If It was Brenton he would be ridiculed tbh

Except his tactics have won trophies.....

People look into this pivotal, process, philosophy, kaizen ethos too much..

It's the way he does things, quite simply how he was taught and how he has taught generations of footballers and coaches.

I was talking to an Ajax youth coach last month, he'd worked with Daley blind himself and van gaal, he's been around the club for decades...the whole Dutch set up is marked from a very early age, 10-13 should be doing ABC, set positions, fluid players able to carry out a number of jobs, different strains of strikers, ball winners, 7-10 year olds in school, speed, positional awareness etc etc, the first team visiting the youth games when they can at the Olympic stadium, wives girlfriends, mother fathers of the youngsters involved, every day a step towards pulling on that first team jersey and doing the job, the 'Ajax way'

Only FM2012 £#%&!ers, the vloggers and Twitter bloggers have taken it upon themselves to publish heat maps and next phase spider graphs, as duckers said, SSN are using computer stats. football overload, endless £#%&!ing reems of pixels that in reality the man running our first team would £#%&!ing piss himself reading....

Every day at the club Van Gaal Is growing, the only problem is people won't or refuse to give him time, one game in and folk on here are close to "there's no future"



We're going to click this season (give it time) and there will be no holding us back...

Originally Posted by rustling jimmies

Great he cleared up in a one team league.

They weren't champions when he arrived and Dortmund won it twice in a row after his title win.

it's a fair point though, he hasn't actually won anything for 5 years at club level, and was sacked by Bayern for following a near Treble-winning season by flopping in the CL and finishing 3rd in a 2 team bundesliga...

Originally Posted by Semantic Lisp

it's a fair point though, he hasn't actually won anything for 5 years at club level, and was sacked by Bayern for following a near Treble-winning season by flopping in the CL and finishing 3rd in a 2 team bundesliga...

Possibly because he largely hasn't been managing a club, pal.

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

They weren't champions when he arrived and Dortmund won it twice in a row after his title win.

Dalgleish springs to mind

Originally Posted by Bunker Buster

We're going to click this season (give it time) and there will be no holding us back...

we've got one 1st pick striker

This bit was glaring for me & very much at the root of my own criticism of Big %@#$&!s:

Van Gaal has always been a manager who wishes to produce for the fans, although since his management days at AZ he has also developed his system to deliver a slightly more cautious approach - this is shown in his Holland WC team and with the current Manchester United team. In the Premier League it is obvious how much the opposition can hurt you if you needlessly give away possession of the football and that has led to Van Gaal's caution based tactics to be insisted on further.

Above all though, Van Gaal aims to be a positive manager, apparent in this statement from the Dutchman "You decide how the opponent play their football and not that the opponent decides where we have to play" he says "I have always played very offensively as a trainer with my teams because I like that. You have to deliver a product for the public"

He has, undeniably, become more cautious as he's got older. Yet with the resources at hand, he's not been able to push for a more exciting side, regardless of the quality of player he can purchase.

I want the old(er) Van Gaal to show himself. He needs to understand United's philosophy, we like attacking football. He's capable, obviously he is £#%&!ing capable, but he's not pushing himself to deliver that, in my opinion.

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

Possibly because he largely hasn't been managing a club, pal.

Previous to that a league championship at Ajax then nothing since the 90's.

He's not the top coach people on here like to think he is.

Originally Posted by rustling jimmies

Previous to that a league championship at Ajax then nothing since the 90's.

He's not the top coach people on here like to think he is.

Erm....

Managerial honours[edit]
Club[edit]
Ajax
Eredivisie: 1993–94, 1994–95, 1995–96
KNVB Cup: 1992–93
Johan Cruijff Shield: 1993, 1994, 1995
UEFA Champions League: 1994–95
UEFA Cup: 1991–92
UEFA Super Cup: 1995
Intercontinental Cup: 1995
Barcelona
La Liga: 1997–98, 1998–99
Copa del Rey: 1997–98
UEFA Super Cup: 1997
AZ
Eredivisie: 2008–09
Bayern Munich
Bundesliga: 2009–10
DFB-Pokal: 2009–10
DFB-Supercup: 2010
International[edit]
Netherlands
FIFA World Cup third place: 2014
Awards and achievements[edit]
World Soccer Manager of the Year: 1995[93]
Onze d'Or Coach of the Year: 1995[94]
Rinus Michels Award: 2007, 2009[95]
Dutch Sports Coach of the Year: 2009, 2014[96][97]
Die Sprachwahrer des Jahres (3rd place): 2009[98]
German Football Manager of the Year: 2010[99]
Orders[edit]
Knight of the Order of Orange-Nassau: 1997[100]

Originally Posted by rustling jimmies

Previous to that a league championship at Ajax then nothing since the 90's.

Apart from winning at the club he was with before Bayern.

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

Possibly because he largely hasn't been managing a club, pal.

possibly yes. it's a long time.

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

Apart from winning at the club he was with before Bayern.

But apart from everything he won, what has he won?

Originally Posted by Baron

This bit was glaring for me & very much at the root of my own criticism of Big %@#$&!s:



He has, undeniably, become more cautious as he's got older. Yet with the resources at hand, he's not been able to push for a more exciting side, regardless of the quality of player he can purchase.

I want the old(er) Van Gaal to show himself. He needs to understand United's philosophy, we like attacking football. He's capable, obviously he is £#%&!ing capable, but he's not pushing himself to deliver that, in my opinion.

I think using the Dutch team and United in the same sentence is a bit of a stretch from the article. I don't see much negativity about this United side, just a failure to really click. We're not as good as his previous sides, but LvG's approach is not the reason Fellaini and Young aren't doing what Overmars, Rivaldo, Figo and Robben did.

There's patently a drop in quality of player in that final third, which needs to be addressed if we're going to see a great side.

Originally Posted by Semantic Lisp

possibly yes. it's a long time.

And in that time players he played a huge part in developing have won the World Cup. Again

Rustling jimmies rustling no jimmies as hard as he tries. Bless him.

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

I think using the Dutch team and United in the same sentence is a bit of a stretch from the article. I don't see much negativity about this United side, just a failure to really click. We're not as good as his previous sides, but LvG's approach is not the reason Fellaini and Young aren't doing what Overmars, Rivaldo, Figo and Robben did.

There's patently a drop in quality of player in that final third, which needs to be addressed if we're going to see a great side.

And in that time players he played a huge part in developing have won the World Cup. Again

that's a completely disingenuous comparison though - you need to use Rooney, Mata, Herrera and Memphis as the nearest comparison, reputation/status wise

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

Apart from winning at the club he was with before Bayern.

Winning the league with Ajax you mean? Not the greatest achievement tbf.

Benitez record is probably better and look how much of a joke he is looked at.

People liking at his achievement in the 90s

Originally Posted by S/Side.Red

I think using the Dutch team and United in the same sentence is a bit of a stretch from the article. I don't see much negativity about this United side, just a failure to really click. We're not as good as his previous sides, but LvG's approach is not the reason Fellaini and Young aren't doing what Overmars, Rivaldo, Figo and Robben did.

There's patently a drop in quality of player in that final third, which needs to be addressed if we're going to see a great side.



And in that time players he played a huge part in developing have won the World Cup. Again

Sorry siders but playing young is negative. Asking mata and depay the way they do is negative. The whole point of playing wingers is to take risks. But LVG is asking them to be so measured and precise, it is going to end up inherently very defensive. How many times do we even see mata or young trying to thread balls through? (although no £#%&!er up front doesn't help I suppose)

All geared towards playing like robots and retaining possession when more instinctive play like herrera's would be much more fun to watch. Even mata would thrive. The only time uniteds attackers got beyond spurs was when their idiot in the middle gifted us the possession 2-3 times.

Originally Posted by Semantic Lisp

that's a completely disingenuous comparison though - you need to use Rooney, Mata, Herrera and Memphis as the nearest comparison, reputation/status wise

I was thinking about how LvG's sides always emphasised great players out wide. That was the basis of the fallout with Rivaldo, who wanted to move from his position on the left to the no10 role. From Overmars/Finidi to Rivaldo/Figo to Robben/Ribery to Young/Mata.

Originally Posted by angrydimaria

Sorry siders but playing young is negative. Asking mata and depay the way they do is negative. The whole point of playing wingers is to take risks. But LVG is asking them to be so measured and precise, it is going to end up inherently very defensive. How many times do we even see mata or young trying to thread balls through? (although no £#%&!er up front doesn't help I suppose)

All geared towards playing like robots and retaining possession when more instinctive play like herrera's would be much more fun to watch. Even mata would thrive. The only time uniteds attackers got beyond spurs was when their idiot in the middle gifted us the possession 2-3 times.

That's still not negative. You might think it's wrong and doesn't use the players you'd like, but it's still not negative. And surely we should give Memphis (who by many accounts looked good on the tour) more than one league game before telling a manager who knows him inside out exactly how to use him? LvG took Memphis to the World Cup and played him off the left side. Let's see a few more games